The Merriam-Webster definition of "operant" = functioning or tending to produce effects.
I don't understand the concept of a passive right shoulder in a hitter's action. I thought that the right shoulder must move downplane to a certain degree to prevent a hitter "running out of right arm". That means that the right shoulder is actively moving downplane to transport the loaded power package for a finite time period before PA#1 releases. Therefore, in that sense, the right shoulder is active (operant) during a triple barrel or four barrel hitting action. I an trying to clearly understand the difference between triple barrel hitting and four barrel hitting from a TGM perspective, and whether the distinction has to involve the release of PA#4 via an active right shoulder downplane movement.
The Merriam-Webster definition of "operant" = functioning or tending to produce effects.
I don't understand the concept of a passive right shoulder in a hitter's action. I thought that the right shoulder must move downplane to a certain degree to prevent a hitter "running out of right arm". That means that the right shoulder is actively moving downplane to transport the loaded power package for a finite time period before PA#1 releases. Therefore, in that sense, the right shoulder is active (operant) during a triple barrel or four barrel hitting action. I an trying to clearly understand the difference between triple barrel hitting and four barrel hitting from a TGM perspective, and whether the distinction has to involve the release of PA#4 via an active right shoulder downplane movement.
Jeff.
Basically it's the "launching pad" . . . the shoulder gets down plane so the right arm can push off the right shoulder . . . kinda like the ground when you jump.
7-12 PIVOT The Pivot is the utilization of multiple centers to produce a circular motion for generating Clubhead Force on an adjustable Plane. Plus the maintenance of balance throughout the weight shifts that accompany the turning and bending of the necessary for the two Line Delivery Paths. A Pivot is on superficially correct that fails to maintain alignments or allows the player to get “out of position”.
It is the massive vehicle which transports the Power Package Assembly to the launching pad and back-up support for the Hitters driving Right Arm (6-B-1). It is the massive rotor, supplying Angular Momentum for the Throw Out power transfer to the Swinger’s orbiting Left Arm (6-B-3).
In both a triple and four-barrel hitter's action, the right shoulder must actively move downplane and in both the right shoulder has to be the launching pad for release of PA#1. So, what's the key (definitional) difference between a triple barrel hitting action and a four-barrel hitting action?
In both a triple and four-barrel hitter's action, the right shoulder must actively move downplane and in both the right shoulder has to be the launching pad for release of PA#1. So, what's the key (definitional) difference between a triple barrel hitting action and a four-barrel hitting action?
If PA#4 is always present wouldn't it be the elemination of PA#3 to make up three barrells of power. Release sequence 4,1,2 no load or unload of PA#3. What do you think Jeff? I like the question.
If a hitter loads correctly and gets his hands to the top of the swing (opposite the right shoulder) with his right forearm perpendicular to the primary lever assembly then his left arm does get across his chest and he is then essentially loading PP#4. That top of the backswing position is common to all hitters. I have never read anywhere that a triple barrel hitter has a different top of the backswing position than a four-barrel hitter, so I cannot imagine that there is a variation in the degree of loading of PP#4 during the backswing.
My first question then becomes is there is difference in the downswing pivot action of a four barrel hitter that causes him to unload PP#4 in a way that doesn't happen in a triple barrel hitter? The second question then becomes - is that first question of any relevance? In other words, is the difference between four barrel hitting and triple barrel hitting related to the unloading of PP#4, or is the difference due to some other biomechanical difference?
Ben - from my understanding of hitter's full power action, one cannot eliminate PA#3. A swinger releases PA#3 after PA#2 during the release swivel action phase of the downswing, while a hitter releases PA#2 and PA#3 simultaneously during the straight line thrust action of the release of PA#1 which applies force to the club in a radial direction (axe handle technique). In other words, my understanding is that both a triple barrel and four barrel hitter must have 1:2:3 in their sequence. My question is whether a four barrel hitter has an active release of PA#4 in his sequence.
If PA#4 is always present wouldn't it be the elemination of PA#3 to make up three barrells of power. Release sequence 4,1,2 no load or unload of PA#3. What do you think Jeff? I like the question.
The Basic Patterns in the 6th Edition in Chapter 12 or both 3 barrell patterns . . . .
Drive Loading . . . Stroke Variation 1,2,3 and Pressure Point Combo is Double 1,3
Drag Loading . .. . Stroke Variation 2,3,4 and Pressure Point Combo Triple 2,3,4
There is more to this short answer than first appears...
The left arm moving across the chest in the backswing does not mean that the acc4 is being used.
3 barrel hitters left arm would go to "top"...left arm across the chest but the pivot would be minimal and would play no role in loading power package....only in creating a backstop for the right arm thrust. There would be no tight sqeeze of the "glove under left armpit". There is pivot motion but in a facilitating way rather than an motion driving way.
4 barrels hitter would go to "top" and uses pivot thrust to load acc4....squeeze the glove under left arm pit... then somehow add on right arm thrust ....
at least that is the only way I can square this apparent circle...
It would be interesting to see 3D motion analysis of these different actions but I think that the 3 barrel hitter could be spotted easily by the relative lack of pivot action...IMO
Your post is of great interest because it implies that the loading of PA#4 doesn't occur in the backswing when the left arm is positioned across the upper chest, but only when the right shoulder thrusts downplane and applies increased pressure at PP#4. Does it state in TGM whether loading of PA#4 is a positional definition or whether PA#4 loading is defined in terms of the amount of pressure felt at PP#4?
The problem with defining loading of PA#4 as the "degree of pressure" felt at PP#4 and implying that PA#4 is not loaded if no/little pressure is felt at PP#4, then it becomes difficult to describe the Leslie King left arm swing methodology in terms of the loading and release of PA#4. In the Leslie King left arm swing methodology, the left arm is positioned against the left upper chest during the backswing without necessarily increasing pressure at PP#4, and during the downswing the left arm is pulled away from the chest due to the active contraction of the left shoulder girdle muscles, which means that no increased pressure is felt at PP#4. In fact, any sense of pressure at PP#4 decreases during the downswing.
The other problem with your concept of four barrel hitting being an increased sense of pressure at PP#4 (due to right shoulder thrust) is that even a triple barrel hitter's action must start with a right shoulder movement downplane that transports the power package down to a position where PA#1 starts to release. The right shoulder downplane thrust may not be as great in that situation and therefore it will not produce as much increased pressure at PP#4, but where would the dividing line be for the "degree of increased pressure sensed at PP#4" as being the definitional criteria that differentiates a triple barrel from a four barrel hitting action?
If a hitter loads correctly and gets his hands to the top of the swing (opposite the right shoulder) with his right forearm perpendicular to the primary lever assembly then his left arm does get across his chest and he is then essentially loading PP#4. That top of the backswing position is common to all hitters. I have never read anywhere that a triple barrel hitter has a different top of the backswing position than a four-barrel hitter, so I cannot imagine that there is a variation in the degree of loading of PP#4 during the backswing.
I am with you here.
My first question then becomes is there is difference in the downswing pivot action of a four barrel hitter that causes him to unload PP#4 in a way that doesn't happen in a triple barrel hitter? The second question then becomes - is that first question of any relevance? In other words, is the difference between four barrel hitting and triple barrel hitting related to the unloading of PP#4, or is the difference due to some other biomechanical difference?
I would say that the difference is in unloading pp4
Jeff.
Jeff,
With 6-B-0 and 6-C-1 in mind.
The difference between a 3 and 4 barrel is which Acc you don´t use actively.
You release the acc with their corresponding pp.
So take a club and swing up to top. Do you feel pp4? Yes.
Now at startdown;
- to do a 4 barrel, start by actively doing a shoulder turn and thereby moving pp4 and then 1,2,3
Here the right shoulder is active
- to do a 3 barrel, start by moving pp1 and then 2,3
Here the right shoulder is passive and the acc4 is zeroed out, is does nothing but allows other things to happen.
How much onplane shoulder thrust does it need to be a 4 barrel? Any!
Now do you need 4 barrel on all shots, all the time?
__________________
Golf is an impossible game with impossible tools - Winston Churchill
Linear Mode
