LynnBlakeGolf Forums - View Single Post - Hogan - closing clubface Thread: Hogan - closing clubface View Single Post #40 06-16-2008, 02:54 PM Dariusz J. Member Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: Poland Posts: 60 Originally Posted by Jeff Dariusz It is very easy to link to photos so that they appear in your text message. There should be a series of formattiing choices at the top of this window, and the one choice is a mountain with a yellow colored sky. If you hover your mouse arrow above that "picture" it should state "insert image". You simply have to click on that "insert image" link and insert your url link. If you cannot find the "extra" formatting options, got to UserCP => click on "edit options" => got to miscellaneous options at the bottom, and then choose "standard editor". Regarding that Jules Alexander photo, it doesn't show the clubshaft at the delivery position. The clubshaft is already well into that part of the downswing called the "release swivel" phase and during this phase of the downswing, the left hand and clubface will undergo a 90 degree rotation into impact. During that 90 degree rotation phase, the back of the left hand will swivel so that it faces the target and it will also face groundwards if the golfer is hitting down on the ball. It is perfectly normal for the clubface, and back of the left hand, to be facing slightly groundwards during the release swivel phase of the downswing - and this applies to all good golfers, and not only Hogan. I think that you would benefit greatly if you did what I did 2 months ago - become an avid student of TGM. It has changed my understanding of the golf swing in many ways, even though I still have a lot to learn. Then, you wouldn't write-: "to square the clubface earlier and maintain it square as long as possible (delayed post-impact swivel and swinging left with an angled hinge); the whole question is if you are able to do it with only left arm pulling...I do not believe it is so easy and so efficient comparing to the right forearm support while swinging the club around..." I think that you have an incomplete/ wrong conception of the golf swing. A swinger may "pull" the club longitudinally with the left arm, but the right forearm and PP#3 control the clubshaft to ensure that it is on plane during the downswing, while the left hand controls the clubface through impact. I don't believe that a golfer should ever "hold" the clubface square as long as possible. In HK's terms, that represents "steering", which is a significant mistake. The clubface should always come into impact with a slightly open clubface, and a good golfer controls its rate of closure through impact/followthrough via a hinging action, which is under the control of the back of the left hand, but biomechanically operant at the level of the left shoulder socket. Any post-impact swiveling action occurs after the followthrough phase of the swing. Here is a post-accident photo of Hogan posing - to demonstrate how he wanted the clubface to be slightly open when it reached the delivery position. If you have "evidence" that Hogan changed his approach to deal with his lifelong hooking problem very late in his career, then could you please i) quote Hogan stating that he deliberately chose to close the clubface earlier in his downswing; and ii) explain how an earlier clubface closure action would be a good anti-hooking strategy. Jeff. Jeff, thanks for helping me with uploading photos possibility, however, I still do not know how to upload a photo from my PC (I do not want to upload using URLs since I do not possess a web site with already uploaded photos). But never mind... I am not going to debate with you or any of the Forum members in a TGM language since my knowledge is very limited so far. Neverteless, I can easily answer your 2 questions using ordinary terms: i) quote Hogan stating that he deliberately chose to close the clubface earlier in his downswing I cannot do it since I believe it is one of the important puzzles of Hogan's secret that he did not want to reveal to anyone. ii) explain how an earlier clubface closure action would be a good anti-hooking strategy It's very easy. In case of pivot guided swings the most efficient motion is to subdue the clubface movement to the body turn; when your clubface is already square to the arc before entering the impact zone no further action is taken in order to close the clubface, because your brain already knows it is square; you, as a Doc, should know much better than me that everything happens in our brain - if your brain "sees" the clubface as closed and, simultaneously, your brain "wants" to hit the ball straight, it won't allow your hands to close the clubface and will force them to be completely passive during the impact zone. Do an experiment yourself - address the ball with a severely closed clubface with an attempt to hit the ball straight forward - you will see how hard (or even impossible) is to hook the ball in such a scenario. What will happen is that you subconsciousnessly hit the ball with a more open clubface that it was at address and most likely (depending on your swing characteristic) you'll obtain a fade pattern. No CP, CF or other forces will be ever able to overcome your subconsciousness. I think that Hogan discovered this phenomenon and he gave us some clues while saying: "if you think that a given thing in your swing will help you - do exactly opposite thing and you'll obtain what you want Cheers P.S. the comparison between Hogan and Woods on those 2 pics of yours is wrong - first, the angles are different, second, they are not in the same moment of the swing. Lastly, look carefully at Hogan's clubface - it is square to the arc already (the whole face of the club is visible). __________________ Dariusz Dariusz J. View Public Profile Send a private message to Dariusz J. Find all posts by Dariusz J.