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-   -   Trevino´s bunkerlesson (http://www.lynnblakegolf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=5150)

Amen Corner 10-09-2007 09:11 AM
Trevino´s bunkerlesson
 
Don´t know if this is elsewhere in ghe forum.

http://flashplayer.streamos.com/flvp...&autoplay=true

interesting though.

Yoda 10-09-2007 09:39 AM
Fun to watch and instructive, too. Thanks, Javier!

Uppndownn 10-09-2007 09:40 AM
Thank you for the post
 
Great link. Thank you.

UPP in stunning Ohio

12 piece bucket 10-09-2007 10:45 AM
Genius! Lee Buck is the best.

KAPLOWD 10-09-2007 10:46 AM
She should also watch "Yoda in Arabia".:thumleft:

powerdraw 10-09-2007 06:39 PM
hmmm.....sounds like a slash down hard on the ball, i'm a little confused with the bounce though....i thought we are taught to use it, he seems to say not too. can i get a clearer pic from someone please? thanks

ThinkingPlus 10-30-2007 08:55 AM
Sand Dictates
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by powerdraw (Post 46003)
hmmm.....sounds like a slash down hard on the ball, i'm a little confused with the bounce though....i thought we are taught to use it, he seems to say not too. can i get a clearer pic from someone please? thanks
I am not the most qualified to answer, but I'll give it a try. I try to expose more bounce (open the face) in bunkers with deep, soft sand to prevent digging too deep . Conversely, in thin or very firm sand I setup with the face more square and minimize the exposed bounce. This lets you cut into the sand a little more. I also play all standard bunker shots with vertical hinging. IMO, you must read the sand (just like reading a green) properly to make the most effective use of bounce in a bunker.

The thing I found most intriguing was playing the ball back a little in the stance which seems to go counter to all the standard advice. I am definitely going to try that my next foray on the golf course.

Uppndownn 10-31-2007 08:12 AM
Try it.........you may like it.
 
Moving the ball back and opening the blade just an eigth of a turn has remade my sand play.......(for this month). :happy3:

Try it........you may like it!

ThinkingPlus 11-02-2007 08:51 AM
Quick Update
 
This seems to be a good approach. I played 9 yesterday and tried this approach in the first bunker I wandered into (really crappy 9-iron I hit from a side hill lie on the 8th). I played the ball just back of the middle of my stance, opened the club a bit, hit down behind the ball, and employed vertical hinging as I always do. The ball popped out nice and high about 20 yards to about 6' (yes I missed the putt :doh: - cost me an under par 9).

It felt as though I had greater distance control and did not have to swing as hard. I suspect with the ball far forward it was much harder for me to get much oomph into my sand shots. I also tended to hit them a little fat. With the ball back I felt like I had more control over where I entered the sand and subsequently did not have to swing near as hard. I practiced a little in the bunkers after finishing 9 and found I could make much easier controlled swings to vary my distance. Kind of amazing really out of practice bunkers hard as rocks. I think I'll keep this approach for awhile. It will be interesting to see if Natalie improves her bunker play as well.

Uppndownn 11-02-2007 09:41 AM
Agreed
 
Steph,

Did you also happen to note that you felt more sand and less ball when you moved the ball back? I know sand shots are supposed to take all sand, and the sand carries the ball out, but until I moved the ball back in my stance, I usually felt the ball through impact. No more....... :naughty: all sand now!!! :laughing9

ThinkingPlus 11-04-2007 10:25 AM
Yes, Indeed
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Uppndownn (Post 46303)
Steph,

Did you also happen to note that you felt more sand and less ball when you moved the ball back? I know sand shots are supposed to take all sand, and the sand carries the ball out, but until I moved the ball back in my stance, I usually felt the ball through impact. No more....... :naughty: all sand now!!! :laughing9
Yep. You are correct. I have on occasion had difficulty, especially when laying my sand wedge way open with slicing right through the sand and hearing a little click. This was no ball first contact, but with the ball so far forward I was not able to penetrate deeply enough in the sand to slide all the way under the ball. The wedge seemed to glide up too quickly (low point probably behind the ball rather than ahead). Of course those were not pretty shots as they tended to rocket out of the bunker with far more pace than expected.

Good catch, Uppd. BTW, I played 36 yesterday with continued success out of the bunkers. All (ALL) my bunker shots so far using this method have come out nice and high with good control. One sandy yesterday with a couple of close calls.

golfbulldog 03-16-2009 06:14 PM
Gret thread, anybody still trying this?

GPStyles 03-16-2009 06:28 PM
I wasn't but will be now!

golfbulldog 03-17-2009 11:52 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by GPStyles (Post 61943)
I wasn't but will be now!
It is hard to explain in TGM terms how this works so well...is it a TGM-sanctioned stroke or just an easy way to compensate...but Gary Player, Chi chi and Lee can't all be doing it so wrong.

An "apparent Back in the stance" ball position means up plane normally (assuming a square/square plane line)...so an onplane stroke should be really out and down with this ball position...

But Lee seems to make a fair point about ball too forward..especially in a swing with minimal weight transfer...

Is it all about low point and sand management??

Help please...:eyes:

GPStyles 03-18-2009 10:51 AM
I would say you hit the nail on the head there about low point sand management.

For too long I've had the ball way forward and have had to manipulate my low point management because I know I'll thin the ball if I don't! This leads to the opposite happening and I keep hitting it fat.

To be fair, I think this has happened by accident though because Dave Pelz says the 'ball forward' is an illusion due to the open stance.

Must go experiment!

:salut:

golfbulldog 03-19-2009 03:58 PM
I just started reading Trevino's "I can help your game" 1972 publication in UK

In his bunker play chapter he advises " when you are playing from sand, it is important to play the ball off the left heel"...maybe he studied the technique of Gary Player later in his life...??

Always looking to learn ...

elygc1 03-20-2009 12:09 PM
Here are some Trevino vids from Utube. I like the #3 pressure point at 1:38 of the first video.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wWzpKfS5dNs

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=481PvLcSwAs

For second video mentions another pressure point for throwaway.

golfbulldog 03-21-2009 01:31 PM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sZFcDudXg5A

Whatever he did...it worked ;)

Scottgas2 03-21-2009 06:01 PM
Anybody else tried the ball back bunker shot?
 
After that vid with Natalie Gulbis, I bet many couldn't wait to try it.
How's everybody doing?

Burner 03-21-2009 06:14 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Scottgas2 (Post 62071)
After that vid with Natalie Gulbis, I bet many couldn't wait to try it.
How's everybody doing?
It works just fine in what passes for bunkers where I play most of my golf.

hardpan 03-22-2009 11:43 PM
Lee's winning wedge
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Yoda (Post 45993)
Fun to watch and instructive, too. Thanks, Javier!
Lee comes in to the golfsmith here in dallas where I'm the clubmaker and over a period of time has warmed up to me a little...he's not near as animated when it's one on one and no cameras :) He had brought a reshafted cally driver in to show me the new metal hosel and i started laughing when i saw all of his epoxied forever fingerprints all over the crown...he told about the ugliest club he ever owned...a Helen Hicks Wilson wedge that he used to win two British Opens...it was circa 1940's so it was old even in the 1970's...At Firestone one year, he had set it up against his car in the parking lot and then forgot and left it behind...when he went back it was gone...later on the range, J.Nicklaus walks up with his HH..Jack said he saw it sticking out of a trash can behind the clubhouse when he short cutted to the range and Recognized it 'cause nobody had a wedge that ugly..evidently a car lot attendant had seen it and tossed it :) ...Lee said he loved it because it had a dot/punch face rather than scoring lines and no matter how you laid the face, you always got a very predictable action..he said he designed and had built a wedge with the scoring lines at a slant so when opened the face, the lines would be more square to the target...his Helen Hicks wedge was later declared illegal because the there were too many dots per square inch...he also said he likes his wedges with a little more offset than usual and will take a 58* and bend it to 56* which increases the offset while reducing bounce...Lee is really really very interesting to talk to...he has great insight and knowledge and it didn't come from a book :)

Yoda 03-23-2009 12:04 AM
Golfsmith Guru
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by hardpan (Post 62104)

Lee comes in to the golfsmith here in dallas where I'm the clubmaker and over a period of time has warmed up to me a little...he's not near as animated when it's one on one and no cameras :) He had brought a reshafted cally driver in to show me the new metal hosel and i started laughing when i saw all of his epoxied forever fingerprints all over the crown...he told about the ugliest club he ever owned...a Helen Hicks Wilson wedge that he used to win two British Opens...it was circa 1940's so it was old even in the 1970's...At Firestone one year, he had set it up against his car in the parking lot and then forgot and left it behind...when he went back it was gone...later on the range, J.Nicklaus walks up with his HH..Jack said he saw it sticking out of a trash can behind the clubhouse when he short cutted to the range and Recognized it 'cause nobody had a wedge that ugly..evidently a car lot attendant had seen it and tossed it :) ...Lee said he loved it because it had a dot/punch face rather than scoring lines and no matter how you laid the face, you always got a very predictable action..he said he designed and had built a wedge with the scoring lines at a slant so when opened the face, the lines would be more square to the target...his Helen Hicks wedge was later declared illegal because the there were too many dots per square inch...he also said he likes his wedges with a little more offset than usual and will take a 58* and bend it to 56* which increases the offset while reducing bounce...Lee is really really very interesting to talk to...he has great insight and knowledge and it didn't come from a book :)
What a great post, Hardpan. And a great story about the Helen Hicks wedge.

Book or no book, Lee's the real deal. Thank you for your insights!

:salut:

GPStyles 03-23-2009 09:07 AM
I haven't been in any bunkers lately :D

GPStyles 03-23-2009 09:08 AM
good post hardpan

hardpan 03-23-2009 11:06 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by GPStyles (Post 62110)
good post hardpan
Even as a well traveled west texas boy (meaning I've been to Odessa, Lubbock, AND Amarillo :) I'm still surprised at who might come into our store and the fact that they're buying grips,shafts etc...where's that tour van when you need it..
Had a gentleman ask if I would regrip his putter while he waited...put one on, nope, tried another, nope, which I then offered him the opportunity to put it on himself which he declined, tried one more and yes, that's the feel he's looking for...after he left one of the guys asked me if I had recognized T.Armour III, huh? He set the PGA scoring record the next week down in San Antonio Texas Open :) Hank Haney has been in to buy grips/shafts..actually introduced himself to the grunt (me) wearing a faded shop apron with dirty hands :)..a genuine Nice guy although I don't understand the Haney Plane.
Feherty has been in a few times, exactly like on TV and super witty..you don't talk to him, you listen....other players too which gives a lift to a sometimes mundane job..if I had continued as a teaching pro I never would have met these guys but Everyone is looking for that magic stick :)

GPStyles 03-23-2009 01:37 PM
I would love to learn how to do all my own regrips and shafts.

The golfsmith home package is mega bucks though:naughty:


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