finding your first wobble point
 

mr.kelly always mentions finding your first wobble point and correcting it before moving on.if you are looking for a way to find this wobble if you have any,is to drill this.get setup to hit a shot and now make you swing in slow motion.i am talking real slow like you are watching a video frame by frame.
what will this show you.first you will see that the golf swing is a hand controlled pivot.you will feel lag loading and lag thrust doing this drill.concentrate on #3 while you are doing this.also from the top work on the start down waggle in slow motion.it is a great drill for devoloping feel.
one more thing for you guys to try is to do the same slow motion drill with your putter.remember to look look to develop your feel.hope this helps you guys like it has helped me

John,

Have you done this drill before working with LB? Do you still do this drill on occasion?

This could be a daily exercise. Slow motion swings. I'm sure a few will do if performed on a regular basis. I've read about many simple drills such as this, and, if a handful were written down and practiced daily :study: , eventually, the gains may be substantial.

VJ Trolio would certainly approve. :hello2: :hello2:

Maybe it's similar to learning anything else. As learning piano, daily drills, drills and drills, scales and arpeggios’ and before ya know it, that Beethoven Sonata was pretty easy.

I’ll try it.

Hogan used to do it lots I think....

This is a good topic.....you need to be able to diagnose what has gone wrong when it does....and fast.....cause it can go quickly....regardless of what you know, or how good you were hittin it yesterday...

I like to start at setup.....adjust that first always. Then 3 Imparatives....

I try not to get into everything else unless neccessary....keep 3 Imp. in mind....

Then pay attention to nothing when you're actually executing....Clear Keys help me with conscious thought.

Great topic...

...

John....haven't heard from u in a while....how's she goin? How you hittin em? What are u working on?

-Paul

More Friends Helping Friends
 

John has been for many years the student of Rob Noel, GSEM, a.k.a. Hunter on this site. We've never worked on this drill together (or anything else for that matter). Through Rob, we have become friends -- :notworthy -- and he told me tonight he got this 'first wobble' idea from watching Ben Hogan go through his 'slo-mo' swings on the Coleman Estate Video (see The Gallery).

Thanks, John, for this great idea. Harvey Pennick was a big fan of slow motion swings, as was another mentor of mine, Paul Bertholy. Not to mention, of course...

Homer Kelley.

thanks guys for the support.i have been incubating for the last 3 weeks.the egg finally cracked,and everything is starting to pour out.i have been working on my stroke pattern throughout drive to putt.trying to make them the same.i have been working on my start down waggle with both drive and putt using this slow motion drill.i am getting ready to put it too a real test i am playing 15 of the next 18 weeks.hopefully everyone will get to check it out on t.v. in the weeks to come.like lynn and i were talking tonight,i have emptied the tank on the practice tee and now i am going to just go play golf.i will be putting up daily post on what is going on with myself and the tour.stayed tuned and if anyone has any questions fire away.let me know what you guys would like to talk about and hopefully i can help.thanks go out to rob noel and to lynn blake for all there support and knowledge.i have learned more in the past 5 months than the last 35 years.keep up the great work guys and talk to you friday

Was watching the Colin Neeman (Name ?? ) video last night and saw Yoda teach the start up with a massive pause (10 seconds), in position to allow the computer to compute...seems like a great idea, especially with slo-mo swings.

After all if we can't do it slow what chance do we have when going at 100mph+!!

Best of luck for you John.

John,

That is a very ambitious schedule. Beside posting here, what do you do to pace yourself so you remain sharp both physically and mentally.

i pace myself by putting in all the hard work while i am at home.both on my body and on the range.i was out for almost 2 years due to 2 surgeries so i have had to get my body back in playing shape.mentally i have been ready it just takes time to get back into tournament shape.the scoring has been slow going but i have been very patient,because i am very mechanically sound with my swing.i just need to play and play alot so it breaks through.that was a tentative schedule and could change at any time.i promise you that i will not play myself to tired to play my best.right now i am going to focus on just playing golf and due periodic alignment checkups.thanks for your questions

Maybe we'll catch up with you at the Milwaukee event? :D

start down waggle
 

I did a thread search on "start down waggle" but came up empty. I have heard this term before, but don't recall it being discussed at Old Waverly. And although I have read the book, somehow this is a point I have missed. Is this important, and why? John and/or Lynn--please expand.:study:

Going down?
 

3-F-5, last paragraph :study: .

Getting Through the Start Down
 

Hi David,

I know I've written on this subject, but not sure where. Maybe someone could help us here. I did demonstrate the Start Down Waggle (3-F-5) from the front of the Lesson Tee at Old Waverly and used it repeatedly with various students during the class. However, with the emphasis on the action itself, I'm not surprised the terminology slipped by.

The Start Down Waggle is a deliberate rehearsal of the Lag Loading Action from the Top and the ultimate cure for Downstroke Blackout and Clubhead Throwaway (6-D-0). Use the Pivot to Pull the Butt of the Club toward the Plane Line (until the Hands are well into their Downstroke 'Slot') and then return to the Top. Repeat several times in a pumping motion. Unless the Waggle is taken through the Release, the Power Package will remain fully Assembled, i.e., the Left Wrist will remained Cocked and the Right Elbow will remain Bent. Extensor Action is mandatory throughout the Motion.

A real key here is to make sure that the Right Shoulder remains back (On Plane) and turns directly toward the Ball. This will provide the On Plane Transportation the Hands need to do their work. Remember the words of Homer Kelley (3-B):

"Those who work constantly -- and fruitlessly -- on Address, Body and Impact actually lack Educated Hands to get them through Start Down -- invariably."

I don't get that quote Lynn....?

I guess he's referring to a pure Pivot Controlled type golfer? All "flail" w/ no concern even as to what the hands are doing?

Educated Hands Rule In the Start Down
 

What Homer is saying is that the Hands must remain On Plane during the Start Down, and they must dictate that alignment to the Pivot. Their relationship is with the Plane Line, not with the Body.

If the Right Shoulder comes off the Plane during the Start Down, it takes the Hands with it. And this is what happens with most golfers. The Hips and Shoulders turn back to the Ball together, the Right Shoulder Turns Off Plane -- it does not stay 'back' -- and the Hands follow. The player must learn to turn his Hips independent of his Shoulders -- Hula Hula flexibility (7-13) -- and thus avoid Roundhousing and its inevitable Clubhead Throwaway. Then and only then will the Hands be able to travel down their Delivery Path toward Impact.

Thanks Lynn. I will review this section and work on this. I know that one of my struggles ON THE COURSE is to avoid "downstroke blackout" while maintaining a nonmechanical "unconcious competence" target/shot awareness. I think Homer's term downstroke blackout is so right on, because in a nutshell it is why my game on the course is NOT my game on the range (at least with regards to ballstriking!). Does anyone else experience this? I would be interested to hear how a tour pro approaches this--John?:think:

Master Yoda,

It's Bagger hanging out with Mozart in Vienna.

There is a wonderful picture of you and Hogan on the Gallery homepage demonstrating your respective start down and release sequences.
Can you touch on the "sag" element of Hogans start down and how extensor action is applied during this motion?
It would be music to mine ears.

Danke Shun,

Bagger

Downstroke Sag
 

Guten Tag, Herr Bagger!

There is a letter floating around the Internet (of doubtful authenticity) in which Ben Hogan describes the 'sag' of the Left Side as the Club moves away from the Ball and the Head remains still. I don't disagree with that description, but again, I would not attribute it to Hogan without further investigation.

So, the 'sag' attributed to Hogan is Backstroke 'sag'.

And then there was an imminent figure in golf in the 1920s and '30s named Seymour Dunn. And Seymour -- I wonder what his buddies called him! :) -- was a major advocate of Downstroke 'sag', the increased Wrist Cocking of Accumulator Lag during the Start Down.

It is to Seymour's sag that you refer, and it is that I will address. In my next post...

'Cuz dinner is ready, and I've got to go get it!

BTW, Paul Bertholy called Downstroke Loading -- Seymour's 'sag' -- the Master Move.

And as I wrote earlier today, Homer Kelley said the average guy is hopeless because he lacks Educated Hands to get through the Start Down.

It's all the same thing. :)

Later!

Look forward to it.
I've seen your extensive library of golf instruction books and articles.
That pigeon hole that some would like to put you in might have a mirror inside.
:rolleyes:

Bagger

Search Engine Not Working?
 

I did a search on "pivot" by YodasLuke and got nothing. There must be an issue with the Search Engine

Search engine has also been acting up for me, at least yesterday it was.

try it again guys...