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alex_chung 07-12-2007 06:08 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hennybogan (Post 43746)
Alex,

I don't think I want to take on the whole forum membership. Lets add you in here and try to create a sort of FAQ. If we can answer enough questions for a few particular guys, then we could cover most of the points. As other questions arise, we could answer those without doing a complete analysis.

Welcome,

HB
Thanks my friend. I did get your PM today but they were making me do work at work for once (what is that about :D)
Anyways, I just used the format that Bucket did and put my thoughts in.

Long Game
·My driver is usually a strong part of my game but once it goes all hell breaks loose!
·My bad shot is weak quail high slice.
·My other bad shot is one that starts straight and then turns right at the apex of its flight.
·Long Iron misses are either high right pushes or thins
·Short Irons are the pretty solid
·Short Iron misses are pretty straight/slight cut or the occasional hosel rocket!
·Finding the clubface/sweetspot is not usually a problem but feel that I am not hitting the ball pure enough.
·Ball flight is generally good. A nice penetrating trajectory. Can hit it high if needed. Low shots are sometimes bothersome but ok.
·Cutting the ball is what I am usually good at. Going the other way is a bit of a problem and I can lose some distance in windy condtions.
·Improving on the down aspect but the out is not there….
·I am a Range Rat. Can hit Pro standard shots on the range but on the course sometimes I look like a complete beginner.
·I tend to swing around my knees and then get across the line at the top.
·Sometimes I overswing too.
·The club goes inside after impact too quickly. A side swipe at times. Costs me distance and accuracy.
·Impact alignments are getting better but not brilliant. Could do better here. More down and definitely more out is needed.

SHORT GAME
·Short/Medium length chip shots are my strength. I'm pretty decent at hitting sand wedge/pitching wedge chips.
·Distance and sometimes direction control on longer chip (almost pitch shots) are pretty bad.
·Low wedges are good. I tend to go for the low runner the majority of the time.
·Flop shots are no good. Low and medium height shots I am more comfortable with.
·Sometimes I flick on my chip/pitch shots. Improving on this.
·Anything from 30-100 yard shots are where I am weak. Tough shot for me as its neither a low one or a full shot. Tendency to chunk, thin or hosel rocket.
·Usually use an 8, 9, PW, SW, LW depending on the shot. Usually carry a 52, 56, 60 wedges.
·Hard, Medium hardness sand are the best bunker conditions for me.
·Putting. Not great but not bad. Ave about 33-36 putts a round. Put left hand low.
I will do more later but its a start. Feel free to ask me more questions.
Alex

8cork 07-12-2007 07:27 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hennybogan (Post 43784)
8cork,

OK. You have had lessons from the A-Team. You talk to Bucket on the phone, so you be gaining in knowledge. You understand the "process" because you use it with your short game and putter. And you are shooting good scores.

We need to find a way to help you transition from playing golfswing to playing golf. It's easy for me to say just think like you do when you putt. It really will end up like that, but it is too big a jump for you right away.

So, for a start, lets cut down on the mechanical thoughts. One swing thought. Pick one. Make it very simple. Like get to your finish. Complete your backswing (might be a good one for you).

Preshot. Again simple. Do your yardage. Go with your first instinct. First thought is seven, hit seven. Do a few practice swings with your swing thought. Do it at your pace, but send that ball away without delay.

Practicing like a pro. They do what we all do in trying to tweak their swings and get that magic feel. Then they work on shutting off the brain and reacting to the target. On the range, get your pattern going and then play a little golf. Picture real shots on the course and try to hit them. Play three or four holes. Hit the tee shot. Change clubs. Hit the iron shot. Don't worry about the chip if you miss. You already have that. Don't drag another ball over if you miss. Go on to the next hole.

For a large part of your practice, you need to behave like you want to behave on the course. It may seem slow and inefficient to practice this way, but the practice will be more valuable.

On game day. When you warm up. Make sure you have plenty of time. Be organized in your mind. Be poised. Get your body loose. Hit some shots with your swing thought. As you get into your pattern, make it more like the course. Lock in on the target. Try to hit the 100 yd. marker. Picture a fairway and hit your driver into it. Pretend there is trouble on one side and room on the other. Hit to the safe side.

Let me know

HB
Thanks for the wealth of information HB, I think the key to me becoming scratch may be found inside this thread, or at least a good kick start.
I am going to apply the practice routine that you suggest and see what happens. I think it will really help to make the move from the range to the course not so dramatic.
I have tried the clear key technique some, but just could never completely commit to it. I do think I need to move closer to that style of playing, but just maybe I can have one swing thought.
I will keep you posted.
Thanks again.

EdZ 07-12-2007 07:33 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hennybogan (Post 43744)
Bucket,

More good info. I think "hit it there" is correct as long as you choose your target based on your pattern. In fact, YES. Pick the smallest target you can. Use your imagination to see the flight.
This is more powerful than I suspect many give it credit. The more I 'see', the better I play.

Hennybogan 07-12-2007 09:08 PM
Visualization
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by EdZ (Post 43820)
This is more powerful than I suspect many give it credit. The more I 'see', the better I play.
EdZ,

I agree that visualization is a very powerful tool. At the highest level, I believe that most players are playing in pictures and feels. I think they spend more effort fitting their games to the course than worrying about their swings.

It is amazing to hear one of them describe a difficult pitch shot in detail. The resistance of the grass. The trajectory. The amount of spin. The exact spot to land. All factors in hitting shots close to the hole.

I believe that the truly great putters see things that the rest of us don't. I'm thinking of guys like Crenshaw that can make it from anywhere.

One of the things that always amazes me is how good most tour players are at very difficult shots. They respond to the numbers and definition of the shot to get completely locked in. Then they miss the fairway laying up on a par five. We try hard to offset this tendency by painting a picture about the lay up.

Some players might not be able to see all the details of every shot, but they still still need to be totally focused on target and feel. When discussing the line for a particular shot, we are always trying to give the smallest target that the player can still see. Not: "At that clump of trees." Yes: "The right edge of the third tree."

HB

Hennybogan 07-12-2007 09:31 PM
Alex eval
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by alex_chung (Post 43805)
Thanks my friend. I did get your PM today but they were making me do work at work for once (what is that about :D)
Anyways, I just used the format that Bucket did and put my thoughts in.

Long Game
·My driver is usually a strong part of my game but once it goes all hell breaks loose!
·My bad shot is weak quail high slice.
·My other bad shot is one that starts straight and then turns right at the apex of its flight.
·Long Iron misses are either high right pushes or thins
·Short Irons are the pretty solid
·Short Iron misses are pretty straight/slight cut or the occasional hosel rocket!
·Finding the clubface/sweetspot is not usually a problem but feel that I am not hitting the ball pure enough.
·Ball flight is generally good. A nice penetrating trajectory. Can hit it high if needed. Low shots are sometimes bothersome but ok.
·Cutting the ball is what I am usually good at. Going the other way is a bit of a problem and I can lose some distance in windy condtions.
·Improving on the down aspect but the out is not there….
·I am a Range Rat. Can hit Pro standard shots on the range but on the course sometimes I look like a complete beginner.
·I tend to swing around my knees and then get across the line at the top.
·Sometimes I overswing too.
·The club goes inside after impact too quickly. A side swipe at times. Costs me distance and accuracy.
·Impact alignments are getting better but not brilliant. Could do better here. More down and definitely more out is needed.

SHORT GAME
·Short/Medium length chip shots are my strength. I'm pretty decent at hitting sand wedge/pitching wedge chips.
·Distance and sometimes direction control on longer chip (almost pitch shots) are pretty bad.
·Low wedges are good. I tend to go for the low runner the majority of the time.
·Flop shots are no good. Low and medium height shots I am more comfortable with.
·Sometimes I flick on my chip/pitch shots. Improving on this.
·Anything from 30-100 yard shots are where I am weak. Tough shot for me as its neither a low one or a full shot. Tendency to chunk, thin or hosel rocket.
·Usually use an 8, 9, PW, SW, LW depending on the shot. Usually carry a 52, 56, 60 wedges.
·Hard, Medium hardness sand are the best bunker conditions for me.
·Putting. Not great but not bad. Ave about 33-36 putts a round. Put left hand low.
I will do more later but its a start. Feel free to ask me more questions.
Alex
Alex,

Sounds like you have a pretty solid game. We all want to hit it better, but your dispersion seems very manageable.

If I remember, you are from Glasgow? Are you playing more links style golf? Are your conditions normally firm? Your short game seems tailored to that type of condition. Just guessing, let me know.

You did not mention handicap or target scores. What are you hoping to gain, or where do you want to take your game?

Shots from 30--100 yards will be critical to lowering your score. Pros practice these shots daily. While some may want to lay up to special numbers, all face these in-between shots throughout a round as a result of misplayed shots.

We will want the total putts number to come down, but it may be a result of hitting more shots pin high and chipping closer.

Let me know what type of courses you play, average score, and ambition for your game.

Thank's

HB

alex_chung 07-13-2007 09:33 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hennybogan (Post 43834)
Alex,

Sounds like you have a pretty solid game. We all want to hit it better, but your dispersion seems very manageable.

If I remember, you are from Glasgow? Are you playing more links style golf? Are your conditions normally firm? Your short game seems tailored to that type of condition. Just guessing, let me know.

You did not mention handicap or target scores. What are you hoping to gain, or where do you want to take your game?

Shots from 30--100 yards will be critical to lowering your score. Pros practice these shots daily. While some may want to lay up to special numbers, all face these in-between shots throughout a round as a result of misplayed shots.

We will want the total putts number to come down, but it may be a result of hitting more shots pin high and chipping closer.

Let me know what type of courses you play, average score, and ambition for your game.

Thank's

HB

Hi there,

Thanks for this.

If I remember, you are from Glasgow? Are you playing more links style golf? Are your conditions normally firm? Your short game seems tailored to that type of condition. Just guessing, let me know.

Yes, I am from Glasgow. My home course is a parkland course and I tend to play there more than anywhere else but I do play some links courses when I have the chance. My home course has a lot of undulations and is more an older style course where you can run shots up to the green and all the trouble is to the sides of the green. Conditions during the summer can get very firm and fast. So the low/medium height running shots are best suited to it. Also controlling a high shot into blustery conditions is quite hard.

You did not mention handicap or target scores. What are you hoping to gain, or where do you want to take your game?

I play off a 13 at the moment (not much time of late to practice or play) My scores tend to average in the mid 80s (Par 70 with a standard scratch of 71)
My goal is to get into Cat 1 (HCP from Scratch to 5) I feel that I have the game to do it at times. I can go for stretches during a round where I am par or better but then it falls apart.

Shots from 30--100 yards will be critical to lowering your score. Pros practice these shots daily. While some may want to lay up to special numbers, all face these in-between shots throughout a round as a result of misplayed shots.

This is a weak part of my game. Its something that I have to work on and I think its more technique that I need to look at as the execution is not there.

Alex

neil 07-13-2007 10:51 AM
This is great guys-not trying to barge in, just letting you know.
The great thing is it stops Bucket posting on his own forum -since March!:salut:

Hennybogan 07-13-2007 11:27 PM
Partial wedges
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by alex_chung (Post 43888)
Hi there,

Thanks for this.

If I remember, you are from Glasgow? Are you playing more links style golf? Are your conditions normally firm? Your short game seems tailored to that type of condition. Just guessing, let me know.

Yes, I am from Glasgow. My home course is a parkland course and I tend to play there more than anywhere else but I do play some links courses when I have the chance. My home course has a lot of undulations and is more an older style course where you can run shots up to the green and all the trouble is to the sides of the green. Conditions during the summer can get very firm and fast. So the low/medium height running shots are best suited to it. Also controlling a high shot into blustery conditions is quite hard.

You did not mention handicap or target scores. What are you hoping to gain, or where do you want to take your game?

I play off a 13 at the moment (not much time of late to practice or play) My scores tend to average in the mid 80s (Par 70 with a standard scratch of 71)
My goal is to get into Cat 1 (HCP from Scratch to 5) I feel that I have the game to do it at times. I can go for stretches during a round where I am par or better but then it falls apart.

Shots from 30--100 yards will be critical to lowering your score. Pros practice these shots daily. While some may want to lay up to special numbers, all face these in-between shots throughout a round as a result of misplayed shots.

This is a weak part of my game. Its something that I have to work on and I think its more technique that I need to look at as the execution is not there.

Alex
Alex,

I think that spending extra effort on the partial wedges will pay huge dividends. I often see pros with unsual moves in their full swings have clean, efficient looking medium to short wedge swings. The swings are short, so there is not much room to accomodate compensations. Just a thought to leave you with. Really try to relax over these shots, the pros are always talking about soft hands when pitching. Practice the technique enough that you don't have to run through a checklist before the shot.

HB

macparrott 07-14-2007 05:42 AM
Multi break on the same putt.
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Yoda (Post 43782)
I've never done this, Henny. Thanks! :)
I just read [u]Putting Out of your Mind[u] by Bob Rotella. In the forward to the book, Brad Faxon talks about putting a breaking putt at three different speeds to develop feel. Rotella talks about the mind being able to make all the calculations in the subconscious mode. Trusting it!

alex_chung 07-14-2007 12:51 PM
Continuing on. My thoughts on my putting, even though I am an average putter I still from time to time miss what looks like the easiest of putts.

PUTTING
·I am a pretty average reader of greens, I can see the line the majority of the time but sometimes have problems trusting that it is the right line and can second guess myself.
·Mid range putts (8-15 feet) I am pretty solid but like my friend Bucket I have trouble from 5 feet and in at times.
·When I miss short putts it’s a combination of line and pace. I can either hit it too hard or baby it.
·I probably have at least 2-3 3 putts a round when I am playing badly. Normal day it’s a 3 putt a round usually at the wrong moment.
·Unlike Bucket, I can get a bit mechanical on the greens but have improved the routine to such that its one look and go.
·Trusting my alignment is a bit of a bugbear as is actually aligning correctly at times.
·Distance putting is average, that is where the majority of the 3 putts come from. Usually from not getting the distance right and I am always short.
·I have found that under pressure I am not a bad putter on most putts. Short ones will give me even more problems.
Through the years, I have read many of Bob Rotella’s books so I feel confident when I get to the ball and stroke it but sometimes I am missing a bit of the puzzle and the confidence goes again until the next time.
Been working on my putting routine a lot recently. Watched a lot of Darren Clarke, Aaron Baddeley and Davis Love on their routines. I like how they all take a few practise swings looking at the hole, line up, one look and then bang. Been trying to keep to that of late.

Alex


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