LynnBlakeGolf Forums - Learning and Applying TGM w/disabilities by a 21 hcp.

Page 28 of 31

LynnBlakeGolf Forums (http://www.lynnblakegolf.com/forum/index.php)

- The Clubhouse Lounge (http://www.lynnblakegolf.com/forum/forumdisplay.php?f=15)

- - Learning and Applying TGM w/disabilities by a 21 hcp. (http://www.lynnblakegolf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=7215)

Daryl

11-16-2012 08:48 AM

Quote:

KEEP THE RIGHT ELBOW IN FRONt OF THE RIGHT HIP THROUGH RFT OR A FULLY STRAIGHTENED RIGHT LEG

Hi ICT,

I don't think the solution is thinking about keeping the right elbow in front of the right hip as Tomasello says. I think that it's the correct GOAL but I don't think it's the way to go about achieving it.

I only viewed the video one time so forgive me if I missed something, but the proper solution is to use a steeper plane.

Use the Right Forearm Take-Away to gain a Steeper Plane, preferably, one of the Shoulder Planes. And, with any of the Shoulder Planes, the Right Elbow will "Clear" (move in front) the Right Hip (Actually, the Plane is what locates the Right Elbow). Trying to keep the Right Elbow in Front of the Right Hip will only Shorten your Backstroke.

And just as important, is Posture. Knees straight and bending from the waist works very well for the Elbow Plane, but a Flatter shoulder turn Backstroke, bending knees, weight slightly back, is compatible with shoulder planes.

The Pivot moves the Right Shoulder and the Right Shoulder Path is going to be a Straight Line Down-Plane, or Over the Plane or Under the Plane.

Under Plane path of the Right Shoulder sticks the Elbow at your side. Over-Plane is not forgivable.

If you don't like the Right Forearm Take-Away, you can use one of the "Turning Shoulder Planes".

innercityteacher

11-18-2012 12:16 AM

Turning Shoulder Plane Takeaway Used today!

Quote:

Originally Posted by Daryl (Post 94186)

I tried Turning Shoulder Plane Takeaway after many "bucket drills" and remembered to keep the right elbow in front of the right hip, ball in front of left foot for driver by 6 inches then shading back and the results were SWEET! :whistle:

Bent Right Wrist stayed perfectly still! The Pivot did all the work lagging the TSP takeaway up and down! So good to be able to step through a shot! Here is some TSP relevant research to the RFAOA (right Forearm Angle of Approach).

Quote:

innercityteacher
Senior Member

Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Philadelphia, PA
Posts: 1,769
Keen insight from Lynn about Impact Fix and the Right Forearm Angle of Approach!

These quotes from Lynn might help in addition and are found here:
http://lynnblakegolf.com/forum/showt...ned+shoulder+p lane#post40634

Quote:
Yoda
Administrator

Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Atlanta, Georgia
Posts: 10,633
Directing Thrust At An On Plane Aiming Point
Originally Posted by rchang72
Just wanted to get input on this. I drew a couple sketches of my impressions of the inclined plane.

My understanding is that we continue the downstroke through impact towards the low point with the down, out and forward. Only then does one come upward into the finish.

So should the actual aiming point along the plane line that is underground (i.e. a little forward of the impact point, and more outside the target line)? Any thoughts?

[Bold by Yoda.]

Very nice, rchang! Because your simple question demands a not so simple answer, I have actually given two answers: the Basic Answer (Item #3) and the Advanced Version (Item #6). Accordingly, I've moved your post to the Advanced Section where any discussion of points #4-#6 should take place. Hang on...this is going to get a little sticky, especially for the newer students.

1. The Target Line could also be labeled the Impact Point Plane Line, and the line passing through the Low Point could be labeled Low Point Plane Line. There should be nothing mysterious about these lablels: They merely identify parallel lines that co-exist on the face of the same Inclined Plane and that pass through two defined points.

2. The Impact Point Plane Line does indeed rest atop the ground, whereas the Low Point Plane Line is in the ground, but again, on the same Inclined Plane.

3. Here then, is the Basic Answer to your question: Because the two Lines are parallel, when you point at one -- with the Tracing Right Forearm and #3 Lag Pressure Point -- you simultaneously point at the other. Therefore, it is sufficient to direct your Thrust at -- but through! -- an Aiming Point on the Impact Point Plane Line.

But, as promised, there is more!

4. The Three-Dimensional Direction of Thrust -- Downward, Outward and Forward -- will be that defined by the Delivery Path of the Hands (7-23). This concept is most clearly illustrated by Photo 10-23-A #1.

5. This Delivery Path Line of Thrust is established at Impact Fix and is parallel to the Right Forearm Angle of Approach: Note (1) the Right Forearm in Photo 10-19-A #2 is pointing directly at the Impact Point Plane Line but well in front of the Ball; and (2) that the Right Forearm is parallel to the Delivery Path. Thus, the Right Forearm Angle of Approach precisely defines:
a. The parallel Delivery Path of the Hands;

b. The Right Forearm's own Cross Line (but On Plane) Thrust through Impact; and also

c. The Angle of Approach of the Clubhead (through the Inside Aft qadrant of the Ball where the eye directs the Delivery Path Thrust via Pressure Point #3 (7-3 and 7-11).
[Note: Photo 10-19-A #2 is meant to depict Drive Loading, not the Right Forearm Angle of Approach. This is the first time -- and possibly the last -- that I will use a photo for a purpose beyond its captioned intent. The reason I've done so is that there is no better photo in the book with which to illustrate this esoteric concept.]

6. So, here then, is the Advanced Answer to your question: The Aiming Point -- established at Impact Fix -- is located at the intersection of the Impact Point Plane Line and the Three-Dimensional Line of Thrust defined by Delivery Path of the Hands and its parallel Right Forearm Angle of Approach. It is precisely down that Line that you direct your #3 Pressure Point Thrust -- Down Plane through the Impact Point and Low Point until Both Arms are Straight (1-L-15).
__________________
Yoda

#2
02-09-2005, 10:10 AM

Yoda
Administrator

Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Atlanta, Georgia
Posts: 10,633
The Angle Of The Turned Shoulder Plane Angle
Originally Posted by EdZ
Great post lynn.

From a hypothetical view point -

If the impact point plane line and the 'underground' plane line were the same (the ball on a tee, exact, perfect low point separation). What angle with the ground would an 'ideal' line of thrust be for the right forearm?
(Assume a perpendicular to the ground primary lever, and turned shoulder plane).
From a down-the-Line view, the Right Forearm during Impact will be on the angle of the Turned Shoulder Plane. This Ideal Plane Angle should not be thought of in terms of an absolute degree of Tilt. Instead, it will vary:

1. From Club to Club (Steeper for the shorter Clubs and Flatter for the longer Clubs per 7-5/6/7);

2. Between Hitters and Swingers (the Shorter Shoulder Turn of the Hitter requires a Steeper Plane per 2-H); and

3. From Player to Player (the less flexible players may have a shorter Shoulder Turn and therefore use a Steeper Plane).
__________________
Yoda

#3
02-09-2005, 11:38 AM

Yoda
Administrator

Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Atlanta, Georgia
Posts: 10,633
Establishing The Clubshaft's Forward Lean
Originally Posted by EdZ
Thanks, I'll have to incubate a bit on the shoulder turn vs. plane, which while it makes sense, I wonder if it is more a matter of anatomy than geometry.

What would your perspective be from a face on view?
The Clubshaft's Forward Lean (2-J-2) through Impact and the Right Forearm's Angle of Approach are dictated by:

1. Club design (2-G);

2. Plane Angle and the consequent Clubhead Line Of Flight (2-N-O);

2. Ball Location (3-F-7-E); and

3. The degree of Right Wrist Bend established at Impact Fix (6-C-2-A).
__________________
Yoda
__________________

ICT

innercityteacher

11-18-2012 12:49 AM

More on the Turned Shoulder Plane-zero shift!

http://lynnblakegolf.com/forum/showthread.php?p=1666&highlight=Turned+shoulder+pl ane#post1666

Quote:

Yoda
Administrator

Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Atlanta, Georgia
Posts: 10,633
From The Top -- Your Way
Originally Posted by MizunoJoe
rwh,

I believe that Doyle and Hebron are talking about transporting the hands with the pivot. I'm talking about the the hands dropping to release point during the pivot, the shaft staying close to the Right Shoulder and the Right Elbow moving in front of the right hip.

[Bold by Yoda.]
MJ,

For a number of reasons, the ideal Swing Plane is the Turned Shoulder Plane (10-6-B). Further, this may be accomplished with Zero Shift (10-7-A) -- that is, the Hands adhere to this Plane Angle throughout the Stroke and execute a Straight Line Delivery Path (10-23-A) to the Ball.

However, the procedure you have described -- "the hands dropping to Release point during the pivot" -- is a viable alternative and is catalogued as the Angled Line Delivery Path (10-23-D). That is, as the Leading Body Transports the Lagging Power Package to Release, the Hands take a nearly Vertical path to the Elbow Plane Angle before they drive directly at and through the Aiming Point.

There is no inconsistency here. There is only Homer Kelley's genius:

Straight Line or Angled Line. Your choice.

And there is no right or wrong. Only personal preference.

This is truth.

This is The Golfing Machine.
__________________
Yoda

Daryl

11-18-2012 01:38 AM

Quote:

Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Atlanta, Georgia
Posts: 10,633
Establishing The Clubshaft's Forward Lean
Originally Posted by EdZ
Thanks, I'll have to incubate a bit on the shoulder turn vs. plane, which while it makes sense, I wonder if it is more a matter of anatomy than geometry.

What would your perspective be from a face on view?
The Clubshaft's Forward Lean (2-J-2) through Impact and the Right Forearm's Angle of Approach are dictated by:

1. Club design (2-G);

2. Plane Angle and the consequent Clubhead Line Of Flight (2-N-O);

3. Ball Location (3-F-7-E); and

4. The degree of Right Wrist Bend established at Impact Fix (6-C-2-A).

Thank's EdZ. You know your stuff.

Answer: all 4

One more

5. Distance at Impact between the Right Shoulder and Low-Point

innercityteacher

11-19-2012 07:37 PM

good video!

Quote:

Originally Posted by Daryl (Post 94222)

Thank's EdZ. You know your stuff.

Answer: all 4

One more

5. Distance at Impact between the Right Shoulder and Low-Point

Bad sound, good ideas of RFAOA! At 1:19 and 3:06 in the video!

http://youtu.be/Qanj07ptUcw

ICT

innercityteacher

11-19-2012 09:17 PM

"Our Longest Drive" and some dead guys

Is anyone watching "Our Longest Drive" on TGC? It is quite sentimental and I like it! I feel like all you readers who read but don't chime in are like the dead guy 'Mike," strange and interesting, needing to be carried everywhere, sometimes. :)

ICT

Daryl

11-19-2012 10:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by innercityteacher (Post 94249)

I'm missing it.

innercityteacher

11-20-2012 09:22 PM

It's ok, I'll fill you in just let me know!

Quote:

Originally Posted by Daryl (Post 94251)

I'm missing it.

Plane great golf! I have played two rounds using Daryl's Right Forearm Angle of Approach insights after putting my clubs away for the season, and shot a 44/42 and a 44/41 even with terrible chipping. There were so many easy going bogies on my cards I knew my technique had improved. Daryl's next tip, changing my Low Point by putting the ball 6" in front of my left foot and feet almost together had me flushing every club through greens and chipping from new places I had not seen on a course I have been playing for 20 years. :laughing9

And today, I figured out how to get to The Turned Shoulder Plane by Swinging less not more. My heel lift/short shoulder turn put my right shoulder back on plane time and again resulting in consistently powerful Acquired Motions that I could translate in a 70 something round.

Having understood the Right Forearm Angle of Approach, and the Adjustable Low Point with Daryl's bucket drill (keeping a weighted bucket in the fingers of the right hand (Impact Fix) and Pivoting back and through without spilling out golf balls), the question arises as to which Plane to use, and as usual, Lynn has a great series of descriptions. :)

http://www.lynnblakegolf.com/forum/showthread.php?p=56283&highlight=turned+shoulder+p lane#post56283

Quote:

tgmgolfer2k2 wrote:

Almost every Tour player has:

- Hands higher at impact than they were at address
- Clubshaft on a steeper plane that at address

Therefore, there's really nothing wrong with this. I'm sure others here can tell you why for certain, and also tell you why it happens.

I'm not sure, so I'll let them handle the explaining.

I hear you, Robot Buddy R2D2!

Due to the Shoulder Turn Axis Tilt, i.e., the tilt of the Spine producedby the Hip Turn Component (7-14), the Left Shoulder is higher at Impact (per7-8 ) than at Adjusted Address (8-3). This raising of the Left Shoulder alsoresults in the higher Hands you have observed. Both the higher Shoulder and thehigher Hands are almost always subconscious reactions that have never beensubject to any conscious Geometric Programming. However, astute students ofG.O.L.F. can avoid this compensated circumstance by positioning properlyfor the correct Shoulder-to-Ball distance at Impact Fix (8-2 and 7-8 ) per theprecision address routine of 2-J-1.

The steeper Plane phenomenon occurs because, while the Clubshaft must start itsjourney on its own Angle of Inclination -- the Elbow Plane (10-6-A) -- it isnot unusual for a player to use a totally different Inclined Plane during theDownstroke (and probably the Backstroke as well).

For example, the player may choose to begin the Stroke on the Elbow Plane andthen use the Single Shift (10-7-B) to locate the Turned Shoulder Plane (10-6-B)at the Top (8-6). The player could then use the Double Shift (10-7-C) to returnto the original Elbow Plane for Impact or alternatively, remain on the TurnedShoulder Plane. The first option would result in the same Plane at Impact as atAddress. The second would be the steeper Plane you have observed.

__________________
Yoda

My issue now is what plane to adopt as part of a consistent pattern for golfing success. The bucket drill seems to leave me on on the Elbow Plane but the lack of compensations from the Turned Shoulder Plane make it very interesting. :happy3: I have shot a 76, 77, 78, two 79's and many 80's this summer not knowing this stuff when my putting and chipping was hot. Sadly, I have had a dozen 87's or worse as well. The goal is to regularly have a chance at par and sub-par!

ICT

innercityteacher

11-20-2012 10:03 PM

Knowing what I do about RFAOA, and the Turned Shoulder Plane could I avoid my messed up lower body with multiple hip operations and set up Impact Fix, lag my hands up to the Turned Shoulder Plane with a slight Shoulder Takeaway to Acquired Motion, and simply step left?

Is there something that violates the Law of Flail or any of the Imperatives in this type of motion? It seems like l am always trying to tone down excess movement!
Insights welcome. This is meant as a discussion question.

innercityteacher

11-20-2012 11:22 PM

Answered my own question or OB Left did!

Quote:

Originally Posted by innercityteacher (Post 94264)

Ok so leading with "Pivot Controlled Hands" is a set of mistakes waiting to happen. :naughty:

OB and TGMers knows why:

http://lynnblakegolf.com/forum/showthread.php?p=84979&highlight=shoulder+takeaway #post84979

Quote:

Yes the #3pp , the entire Right Foream Flying Wedge (which near Impact has rotated onto the Inclined Plane too) and for some the Right Shoulder crush the Aiming Point which in on the Arc of Approach.

Relevant to this discussion, the glossary's definition of the Pivot.....(its role for the TGM golfer given independent arm and pivot motion)

Quote:

PIVOT Example -revolving door.

Mechanical -That motion of the body moving around a center point.

Golf- A multiple universal-joint assembly between the Stationary Head and the Stationary Feet holding the Clubshaft "On Plane" by positioning and adjusting the Lever Assembly , through the #3 Accumulator , as directed by the Right Forearm.

Homer said " Stationary Head" but I believe it could read "Stationary PIvot Center" which gives you options other than the head literally speaking. I love the way this definition establishes a hierarchy between Pivot and Right Forearm. Homer said we'd all feel like we were tossing a ball. Dont get me wrong the Pivot is important, it is Zone 1 after all. But the pitcher on the mound is not rifling a fast ball with his pivot alone. He probably isnt thinking about his pivot, after training. YOu dont say "what a pivot on that guy", you say "what an arm on that son of a..." etc.

This means that (with the exception of Startdown) the Shoulders can travel in a different direction than the Hands. Which sounds complicated, but we do it all the time , all day long. We are "wired" to do so. Putting your thoughts on your Pivot messes things up (although its necessary when specifically training your pivot). All you need to do is to take your bent right hand to right shoulder high.........like you were reaching for something. If you can establish a TSP at Top then you wont need to re arrange things (shift planes) so the Pivot (the Right Shoulder) can pull the Hands downplane in Startdown with the #4 still fully loaded......delayed Release, Delivery of the Power Package to its Release Point. Its this last point that everyone tries to manage I think. But I believe you can do it effectively , easily without a significant Plane Shift or an uncomfortably high Shoulder Turn. Without strapping your arms to your chest. Homer's Standard Shoulder Turn seems odd at first but its brilliant. With independent arm and pivot motion ,your arms can flow freely from the body , freewheeling AND Aligned even when the Body is pulling them down in Startdown (given a TSP). Even if you are non Auto Release Throw and Hand manipulating etc. Im not just talking passive wrists , fully auto, Swinging here. The baseball pitchers right arm is thrown and his hand manipulation creates the curve ......... His pivot accelerates his arm and then his arm accelerates even more away from his body

Ok, RFT not Pivot Controlled hands!

ICT

innercityteacher

11-27-2012 03:58 PM

Extensor Action Necessity

Quote:

Originally Posted by innercityteacher (Post 94267)

So, it is the highest priority for consistent championship level play, or regularly breaking par, (IMHO, since I haven't done it yet)(for those of us not playing 5 hours a day) to fully straighten the right arm at Impact Fix maximizing Extensor Action below plane since right palm holds the Plane underneath palm touching and left hand rests on top of the Wheel Rim for the swinger with manipulated hands or the Hitter who really does "carry it back" with the extended right arm struggling against the left arm "Check Reign." Thanks LBG! :notworthy

The Power Package is given shape and concistency in the easiest most consistent using this technique. :thumleft:

I hope I am not being vapid in my response. :idea1:

ICT

Daryl

11-27-2012 06:05 PM

Oh boy........:doh:

innercityteacher

11-28-2012 01:33 PM

The beauty of Both Arms Straight

Quote:

Originally Posted by innercityteacher (Post 94357)

So, it is the highest priority for consistent championship level play, or regularly breaking par, (IMHO, since I haven't done it yet)(for those of us not playing 5 hours a day) to fully straighten the right arm at Impact Fix maximizing Extensor Action below plane since right palm holds the Plane underneath palm touching and left hand rests on top of the Wheel Rim for the swinger with manipulated hands or the Hitter who really does "carry it back" with the extended right arm struggling against the left arm "Check Reign." Thanks LBG! :notworthy

The Power Package is given shape and consistency in the easiest most consistent using this technique. :thumleft:

I hope I am not being vapid in my response. :idea1:

ICT

Another great feature of the Right Fore Arm Angle of Approach and Extensor Action obtained by straightening the right arm is the ease and consistency with which a golfer reaches full width and power of the Both Arms Straight position on the way to the Finish Swivel and "arrow through the ear" finish. \\:D/

ICT

Yoda	12-06-2012 10:48 PM

Hogan Would Be Proud

Quote:

Originally Posted by innercityteacher (Post 94362)

Great summary, Patrick. Thanks!

:salut:

innercityteacher

12-07-2012 12:44 AM

An incredible amount of education in four short days!

Quote:

Originally Posted by Yoda (Post 94468)

Great summary, Patrick. Thanks!

:salut:

Lynn, I have said it before and will say it again, my four short days with you as my instructor, and also watching you instruct others, was a revelation of precision and power. Specific terms for specific movements demystifying the pieces of golf alignments. After 10 years of doing it the wrong way, I had a lot of fog but with your instruction, Daryl's help, Kev's Jerry's and OB Left's, and others, I feel the LAG dragging and driving! :golfcart2:

Par is our friend!

ICT

Daryl

12-07-2012 04:43 PM

Ok, here we go.

City,

This sums up about everything we talked about.

Flying Wedges aligned at 90 degrees
Pivot
Right Forearm Angle of Approach

See those Wedges? See the Red Dots? See at Impact, his shaft is vertical and his Right Forearm is On Plane on its Angle of Approach at Low-point? Shaft and right forearm frozen together. Right hip turns left.

Watch his address waggle. Very interesting: His hands, during its approach, passes his left shoulder (hinge location) while going to Low-Point but his shaft is no where near vertical. He fixed that during the Actual Swing. He may have been testing the Alignment. Look at his stance width.

In his video, he is Swinging his Arms (on an Elbow Plane). Oh well.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xJwN...oeZBg&index=15

I guess it was too good to be true. There's that old Impact Bent Left Wrist syndrome. Maybe if he tried the "Taly" it could help?

Everything was going great, then for some unexplained reason he added a hand swivel. Why? He should know better. He invented the Taly!

But I think I figured it out. He was so far ahead of the Hinge during his address waggle that he knew the face wasn't going to close enough. So, he swiveled. Oh well. Another one bites the dust. Remember HK said that all of this must be accommodated at Impact Fix.

innercityteacher

12-07-2012 07:15 PM

Lmao!

Quote:

Originally Posted by Daryl (Post 94487)

I have the Taly and it does help!

ICT

Daryl

12-07-2012 08:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by innercityteacher (Post 94490)

I have the Taly and it does help!

ICT

is it helping him? knowing that you're doing something wrong helps, but it helps more if you know whats wrong and how to do it right.

innercityteacher

12-07-2012 09:03 PM

Let me explain!

Quote:

Originally Posted by Daryl (Post 94493)

is it helping him? knowing that you're doing something wrong helps, but it helps more if you know whats wrong and how to do it right.

I knew that I needed a flat left wrist. I did not grasp with the Tally, that the Bent Right Wrist and proper right elbow position and proper Right Forearm Angle of Approach with Extensor Action below plane were all essential to keeping the flat left wrist flat but only if you turned and dragged the lag left maintaining the flat left wrist turning to completion. :whistle:

Tonight at the range, I turned my right hip so freely that with a balmy 45 degrees evening and cold rain, I hit my old Adams PW 125 yards right after stepping out of the car at the flag! It felt like I could've hit it a lot farther with a little practice in timing the lag, but just wanted to loosen-up. So much lag was flowing forward into the ball it was amazing. :whistle:

I lost the driver in the mist at 190 yards on it's way up. The 2 hybrid was feeling like it it might've dipped down angle at the 190 yard mark!

ICT

Daryl

12-07-2012 09:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by innercityteacher (Post 94495)

That sounds great. It's a very good pivot isn't it. Doesn't everything seem easier? Less effort? Thank Homer Kelley.

HungryBear

12-08-2012 10:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Daryl (Post 94487)

Watch his "HEAD". What do U see?

HB

innercityteacher

12-08-2012 01:50 PM

How do I finish the Finish Swivel?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Daryl (Post 94496)

That sounds great. It's a very good pivot isn't it. Doesn't everything seem easier? Less effort? Thank Homer Kelley.

I don't mean to be a greedy "golfing pig" here, but last night at the range I felt like my Finish Swivel was greatly lacking I know it's importance! :read:

Impact Fix/level bucket no tipping with a more narrow stance, Extensor Action is now my start-up, pushing below and away to the top of my right shoulder, TSP, stretching out the Power Package, grabbing the wheel rim with the fingers of both hands Bent Right Wrist on plane :dance: Swinging, and turning left with my right hip.

To finish a successful Finish Swivel, I know I must "prepare" as Lynn says since "that's where the Golfing Machine lives!" I was dragging the mop so powerfully but could not sense the decisive snap of the Finish Swivel. Perhaps I am such a big fan of the Angle Hinge and it's straight flight that I favor that layback more than the gentle roll characteristics of the Horizontal Hinge I now hit? Perhaps my stance is too narrow?

That's probably it, my low point is too far forward since the ball sort of gently floats left at a very high apex. :eh: Related to that would be my my losing balance left almost and the long pause before I feel the lagging power package drag down plane-to much slack in the fishing line-and with a senior shaft to boot :rolleyes: .

Or, do I need to let the club gently overtake the left arm? But doesn't rhythm demand the left arm stay even with the club face? :dontknow: I remember Lynn's nice tape on the golfer's flail- I will need to look at that. I am out of my depth again! LOL!

Here it is and look at that Right Forearm Angle of Approach and that red dot facing the sky all the way through to the Finish Swivel! :thumright

http://youtu.be/EDNCLchMYRI

Or maybe, my Extensor Action is maintained too loo long in the downswing?

ICT

innercityteacher

12-09-2012 03:01 PM

Ok, I feel like an idiot-"You must prepare!"

Quote:

Originally Posted by innercityteacher (Post 94499)

I have not really grasped the power of my right hip nor the simplicity of it until uhmm, now! :rolleyes:

Extensor action to the TSP and leave everything there and still! Prepare! Flick the hip left at the ball and let the club carry you down, out, and forward swivel to the finish arrow through the ears! :idea1:

Man, does that PP # 3 feel loaded!

ICT

innercityteacher

12-09-2012 07:37 PM

Synchronicity! Back hip and PP # 3

Quote:

Originally Posted by innercityteacher (Post 94517)

http://youtu.be/OdHmOuADZjo

Impact Fix, Extensor Action to whatever plane you like and turn the back hip left to
pull PP # 3 LIKE TWO GEARS SYNCHRONIZED TO BLUDGEON THE BALL WITH LAG AGAIN AND AGAIN! :golf: I feel bad for the current club champion! :whistle: :read: :read:

ICT

Yoda	12-09-2012 07:54 PM

Lag Pressure Versus Release Motions

Quote:

Originally Posted by innercityteacher (Post 94499)

I was dragging the mop so powerfully but could not sense the decisive snap of the Finish Swivel.

Remember, "dragging the big, heavy, wet mop" refers only to the FEEL of Clubhead Lag Pressure Point Pressure. A driving, inert, steady-as-she-goes, unrelenting pressure (generally felt in Pressure Point #3, the right-hand forefinger). The feel of the stressed Clubshaft and the Sweetspot chasing its driving force.

This driving Lag Pressure is its own. Lag Pressure does not refer to the Release Motions (Uncock and Roll) that must occur during the Release Interval (Release to the end of the Follow-Through / "both arms straight" position). Nor does Lag Pressure refer to the Finish Swivel (the action that serves as the bridge from the end of the Follow-Through to the Finish).

So, "mop dragging" is all about pressure -- Clubhead Lag Pressure. This is what you must feel. This is what you must do.

The Second Imperative (2-0) . . .

Indispensable for all Strokes.

:golfcart2:

innercityteacher

12-09-2012 07:59 PM

Synchronicity! Back hip and PP # 3!

Quote:

Originally Posted by innercityteacher (Post 94519)

http://youtu.be/uSZB_p7jgvo

Thanks Martin Chuck!

ICT

Daryl

12-09-2012 09:18 PM

You've become a Lag and drag monster. :clap:

I don't see the value in Chucks video. He doesn't take his grip at Impact Fix. He doesn't explain the difference between Swiveling the Right Hand vs. an On Plane Right through the Impact interval and the difference in rotation between the two. And, he starts by saying something about "shanking" but then doesn't explain that in the context of this video, it's caused by Swiveling.

Yoda	12-09-2012 10:11 PM

More Is Better

Have expanded my post #1105 above. Worth a re-read.

:golfcart2:

innercityteacher

12-09-2012 10:22 PM

Thanks Yoda!

Quote:

Originally Posted by Yoda (Post 94520)

I now can feel the lag in PP # 3 consistently and when I turn my hip, my machine pulls that PP # 3 down, out and forward through Impact, to Both Arms Straight up, in and back!

I was glad to see Martin chuck's recognition of the Sweet spot related to PP # 3. :dance:

ICT

innercityteacher

12-09-2012 10:25 PM

Martin Chuck is making progress!

Quote:

Originally Posted by Daryl (Post 94522)

I am always happy for progress Daryl as I have not hit perfection yet!

Thanks for the help in being Synchronized! It is cool to always feel the LAG!

ICT

innercityteacher

12-09-2012 11:24 PM

Aiming Point?

Quote:

Originally Posted by innercityteacher (Post 94525)

I am always happy for progress Daryl as I have not hit perfection yet!

Thanks for the help in being Synchronized! It is cool to always feel the LAG!

ICT

So If I feel the lag in PP # 3 regularly, know how to fire it down plane with my back hip, the question will occur about where to fire the lag. I know I can fire it to the inner quadrant of the ball but where else and to what purpose? :read:

Progress, not perfection!

ICT

Yoda	12-09-2012 11:25 PM

Truth and Consequences

Quote:

Originally Posted by innercityteacher (Post 94524)

I was glad to see Martin chuck's recognition of the Sweet spot related to PP # 3.

Since 1969 and its first edition, The Golfing Machine has made a difference.

In some lives more than others.

Mine being an extreme case!

:toothy1:

Modern high-tech machines (such as TrackMan) are just now showing how right Homer Kelley was. Dead since 1983, Homer would revel in today's instantaneous display of impact data. He would applaud the radar accuracy. He would, however, bristle at some of the conclusions drawn by these "nouveau scientists" and their followers.

Why?

Well, for starters, these conclusions are buttressed by those who subscribe to the service, pay dearly for the privilege, and who quite humanly reinforce its result. The "numbers" -- most mathematically derived -- and resultant bright displays dutifully reinforce the subscribers' dues and sentiments. I think this "new guard" is now enamored, empowered, and misled by their own assumptions.

At the 2011 PGA Merchandise Show, I had an extended two-hour conversation with TrackMan's father, Fredrik Tuxen. Since then, things have been playing out kinda as I expected. At least one or two of TrackMan's recent announcements have moved their "science" closer to Mr. Kelley's work, not further away. Go figure.

There still is at least one major issue in play: the correct Clubhead Path through Impact (and how to make it happen).

Do you swing to the "right" with the driver and to the "left" with everything else? Must the Plane Line rotate "Closed" with the driver (and its lauded "Upstroke") and "Open" with everything else (and their "Downstroke").

We'll see how it goes . . .

:golfcart2:

KevCarter

12-10-2012 08:01 AM

The Truth Will Set You Free

Quote:

Originally Posted by Yoda (Post 94527)

Great post Yoda. So great to have a system to believe in while others are being led in circles. Fine tuning as we go, no need to rewrite the book.

Kevin

innercityteacher

12-10-2012 01:54 PM

Holding a golf ball in my right index finger-aim point and circles and planes

Quote:

Originally Posted by KevCarter (Post 94528)

Great post Yoda. So great to have a system to believe in while others are being led in circles. Fine tuning as we go, no need to rewrite the book.

Kevin

On my last day with Lynn or so, he showed me how to hold a golf ball in my right index finger so my finger looked like a question mark. Not only did that show me how to put my right hand on the club, but it is also my model now for throwing the ball via Aim Point on the plane. Homer taught Lynn and others what was/is true about the golf club plane and what they teach in one set of insights can be as appropriate in other golf applications. I'm speaking about the "durabilty of truth." Gravity works under the ocean, on the ground, and in outer space albeit at different speeds. Gravity, like the flying wedges, always has to be accounted for.

It's my thread and I reserve the right to be "off the hook" whenever I want to be! :happy3:

ICT

innercityteacher

12-10-2012 02:04 PM

Aim Point for idiots! Ok, having figured out how to turn my back hip in synch with my PP # 3 and having so much power using the Right Forearm Angle of Approach, the question arises as to where to drag or drive that power to? So I'm starting the research on this Forum and watching you tube videos to get an answer I can use.

Comments and harangues are welcome!

http://www.lynnblakegolf.com/forum/showthread.php?p=60186&highlight=aim+point#post601 86

Quote:

Thom
Senior Member

Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Copenhagen
Posts: 345
hitting up is dangerous
Originally Posted by GooseofIron
If I've got it right, Clampett has it about 4 inches in front of the where the ball is.

You *can* do it for drivers, but the Trackman devices are showing that basically you want the aimpoint for a driver before the ball because you want to hit up a little with a driver. Recent article showed that JB Holmes and Tiger had virtually the same swing speed, but Holmes was hitting about 3 degrees up with the driver whereas Tiger was hitting 3 degrees down and that is believed to be why Holmes hits it much further than Tiger.

3JACK

Thom continues -Clearly the Trackman wil show you that high launch/low spin is the recipe for distance. But IMO it's a dangerous swing thought.
If the club is on it's way up, it has passed the low point. If it has passed low point the clubface is closed. If the face is closed, you'll hook it. If you don't want to hook it, you'll have to swing your driver and use vertical hinging, which is a layback only procedure better used with the short game strokes.
The hit up thought, coming from all the launch monitor results, could be the reason a lot of golfers want open face drivers now a days.

I think the AP before the the ball is due to the driver being a longer club and it needs more time to square up. That's why you need to start the release ealier, and that's what an AP before the ball will do.

Maybe one of the pros can explain this much better!

innercityteacher

12-10-2012 02:17 PM

Ohhh a good one by who else?!

[quote=innercityteacher;94532]Aim Point for idiots! Ok, having figured out how to turn my back hip in synch with my PP # 3 and having so much power using the Right Forearm Angle of Approach, the question arises as to where to drag or drive that power to? So I'm starting the research on this Forum and watching you tube videos to get an answer I can use.

Comments and harangues are welcome!

http://www.lynnblakegolf.com/forum/showthread.php?p=59613&highlight=aim+point#post596 13

Quote:

Yoda
Administrator

Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Atlanta, Georgia
Posts: 10,643
Aiming Point -- A Few Feet Too Far
Originally Posted by exgolfpro

I understand the idea behind the Aim point. I had always done this with my wedges, but didn't know how to verbalize to others how I did it. So, now I am trying to integrate this point thru the rest of the bag. My question is..how far is too far forward? I get pretty good results while using my irons if I drive my hands at a point a good 12-15 feet in front of the ball. The only visual I have seen of the aim point is in Bobby Clampett's book Impact Zone and he shows it being about 4-5 inches in front of the ball. Am I overdoing it?
Ex,

Study the Aiming Point (6-E-2);

The Hands Lane (Photo 9-3-6); and

The Delivery Paths (10-23-0/A).

Once understood, the golfer knows that Thrust can be directed AT the Ball (assuming its Location at the specific Club's Straightaway Point); IN FRONT of the Ball (for the Shorter Clubs); or BEHIND the Ball (the longer Clubs).

Bottom Line: Once the Aiming Point is understood, the player rarely directs Thrust more than 1-2 inches in front of the
Ball, much less 10-15 feet. As far as 'behind' the Ball; that point apparently has been lost.
__________________
Yoda

I declare this post the winner with no hanging chads!

ICT

KevCarter

12-10-2012 02:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by innercityteacher (Post 94531)

I LOVE your thread!!!

I only post when I have something to say. You and the other guys are usually over my head, but I learn a lot from your posts! :golfing_banana:

Kevin

innercityteacher

12-10-2012 02:26 PM

Aim Point continued

[quote=innercityteacher;94533]

Quote:

Originally Posted by innercityteacher (Post 94532)

Good question and answer!

http://www.lynnblakegolf.com/forum/showthread.php?p=41733&highlight=aim+point#post417 33

Quote:

12 piece bucket
Senior Member

Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Thomasville, NC
Posts: 4,378
Originally Posted by deckhead
AIM POINT 6-E-2.

I took lessons from a man who was NOT a TGM degree holder, but taught out of the book.

I cut the ball all of my life. He had me place a tee where I would normally tee the ball. Then he would put a ball on a tee about 6-8" in front of the tee. He had me aim at the tee in front of me while hitting the ball, all while hitting downoutthrough. The ball flew straight or drew. Is this what 6-E-2 is describing?
100% correct! Some folks confuse aiming point with low point . . . kind of like a bunker shot where you look at the sand and HAVE THE CLUB STRIKE THE SAND AT THAT POINT. Aiming Point as you have seen demonstrated is about directing THRUST . . . not the Destination of the Clubhead. 6-E-2 is one of the best contributions of Mr. Kelley to golf. With the aiming point procedure you can have the Aiming Point be CONSTANT and move the ball to have the same release feel . . . OR you can keep your ball position constant and move the Aiming Point forward, aft, or at the ball.

Mr. Kelley in the 4th edition had a particularly lucid example of Aiming Point being like the free hand drawing of straight lines on a chalk board. You place your chalk on point A, look at point B and draw the line. By looking at the chalk you'd screw the pooch. So with aiming point from the top . . . you are mentally constructing a straight line of thrust from top down and THROUGH the Aiming Point via your #3 Pressure Point . . . . that pressure point is your chalk, the starting point is Top, the straight line is the extension of the Straight Line Delivery Path of your hands (and lag pressure) and the destination is down and through the aiming point which is on your Delivery Line.
__________________
Aloha Mr. Hand

Behold my hands; reach hither thy hand

innercityteacher

12-10-2012 02:30 PM

You are nicer than I am and a better golfer and golf teacher!

Quote:

Originally Posted by KevCarter (Post 94534)

I LOVE your thread!!!

I only post when I have something to say. You and the other guys are usually over my head, but I learn a lot from your posts! :golfing_banana:

Kevin

I have not forgotten Kev. We were talking about a IL/WI/MN summer visit last night but I have to make sure they do not close my school at the end of this year! :eh:

ICT

O.B.Left

12-10-2012 03:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Yoda (Post 94527)

There still is at least one major issue in play: the correct Clubhead Path through Impact (and how to make it happen).

Do you swing to the "right" with the driver and to the "left" with everything else? Must the Plane Line rotate "Closed" with the driver (and its lauded "Upstroke") and "Open" with everything else (and their "Downstroke").

We'll see how it goes . . .

:golfcart2:

Nice to hear from you Yoda.

Ill take Grip Rotation for extra yards please Alex. Draw shot tendency yes as the ball POSITIONING moves back along the Arc of Approach but It's mitigated by the more upright Plane Angle ... More down , less out associated with shorter sticks and there more upright lie and plane angles .

How bout you personally Yoda.

" Grip or Plane Rotation?" Asked Ed McMahon to the great Carsini.

All times are GMT -4. The time now is 02:11 PM.

Page 28 of 31

« First

Last »

Show 40 post(s) from this thread on one page