Where do I start?

[Mike O]

Bucket,
OK - we've got TGMnut right where we want him - a few more posts and he won't be able to hit it out of his shadow- why don't you throw in that holding his breath on the backswing would be good- PM me back with our next line of attack- Oh Ya - what time are we playing him next weekend? Wait a minute!? I think I just posted this on the forum instead of sending a PM

[Mike O]

Yoda, Bambam, Mike O, 12 Piece,
I don't know how to thank you guys enough. All this feedback is incredible. I do feel like I hit the golf instruction lottery, as 12 Piece said. You're not kidding Denny, that was definitely worth some money. Mike, you're absolutely right, my swing has always been about hitting the ball as far as I can, even when I've tried to force myself to swing more under control. Yoda, I thought last night after watching my swing that I had that loop, but I wasn't sure I was seeing things quite right. Thanks for confirming my suspicion. I was also pretty sure I was lost in that scary nether world of switting, but I've thought that for a while. Mike, thanks for the huge response. I completely overlooked the fact that I was standing up and losing my spine angle. Also, you made me realize something else. I've been an athlete my whole life and I think sometimes I think too much and make things harder than they need to be. One other thing, I am more than willing to give up some of that power I crave if I can get it back and become much more accurate and consistent in the process. I am very driven to get better and I don't really care what it takes right now, I just want to be damn good at this game. I'm going back to the range in the morning and hope to have more video posted by tomorrow night. Thanks again for everything guys!
nut

Funny - in regards to thinking- I thought before I posted that it was somewhat odd- or not quite the norm - that an athlete such as yourself would be drawn to TGM- normally you guys just do it (No I'm not talking NIKE here!)

Here is my additional advice to your follow-up post. While you might think that - "Hey! All this thinking is just holding back my natural ability- therefore let's not think so much"- nothing could be further from the truth. Although, believe me I understand the feeling. In fact, you may have already gone back and forth on those two philosophys many times in your golfing career. Certainly if you're at a fork in the road and you've got to decide- "Do I go down the left hand road and just use my athletic ability" or "do I go down the right hand road and try to figure out and consciously apply movement concepts to swing a golf club"- You know the left hand road will look the easiest and in fact when you're on it it'll seem the easiest- but then at some point when you don't get better you've got to apply some knowledge- anotherwords you need to get back on that other road. When you start to think and apply knowledge and you don't get any better then after some time on that road you're thinking "This isn't helping - I need to get back on the other road"-The Athlete Road- "why am I mentally and physically "forcing" myself to do this when I'm getting worse or not getting better!" So you switch back over to the athlete non-thinking road. Well you get the picture. In summary- my advice- "struggle my friend!" - Take the road less traveled~!

[Mike O]

Mike you may want to recruit this bruser to do your lite work.

He could probably hold up the Gremlin and drop it on peoples' heads.

Now G.O.L.F. . . . How come I need to fix my Forward Sway and he gets to keep his? Is it because I am a wus and he is a giant stud?

Yes, I thought so also- he (TGMNUT) would be a good asset for the team- take bagger's neck and twist it around like a pretzel! Sorry - Day dreaming there for a minute. You said you needed to fix your forward sway not me! But I think you have it right- the wus/stud thing. Also could be that as of July 7, 2006 there were 2,999 members on the forum here that wanted you to take up bowling!!!! And PLEASE don't ask me to verify that statement by forwarding all 2998 PM's (Hey, Yoda wanted to PM me but he didn't want his true feelings in writing!- OK- well maybe he didn't even say it BUT if I had talked to him I'm guessing he would have even opened up the damn Bowling web page himself! And if he doesn't post to the contrary in the next 5 seconds well then it's confirmed! Now, get back on that sofa Wus Boy!)

[tgmnut]

Funny - in regards to thinking- I thought before I posted that it was somewhat odd- or not quite the norm - that an athlete such as yourself would be drawn to TGM- normally you guys just do it (No I'm not talking NIKE here!)

Here is my additional advice to your follow-up post. While you might think that - "Hey! All this thinking is just holding back my natural ability- therefore let's not think so much"- nothing could be further from the truth. Although, believe me I understand the feeling. In fact, you may have already gone back and forth on those two philosophys many times in your golfing career. Certainly if you're at a fork in the road and you've got to decide- "Do I go down the left hand road and just use my athletic ability" or "do I go down the right hand road and try to figure out and consciously apply movement concepts to swing a golf club"- You know the left hand road will look the easiest and in fact when you're on it it'll seem the easiest- but then at some point when you don't get better you've got to apply some knowledge- anotherwords you need to get back on that other road. When you start to think and apply knowledge and you don't get any better then after some time on that road you're thinking "This isn't helping - I need to get back on the other road"-The Athlete Road- "why am I mentally and physically "forcing" myself to do this when I'm getting worse or not getting better!" So you switch back over to the athlete non-thinking road. Well you get the picture. In summary- my advice- "struggle my friend!" - Take the road less traveled~!

That's probably exactly what I needed to hear. I have no problem with thinking things through, I guess I just needed someone to tell me that's what I ought to be doing. By the way, how can you continually post from the trunk of Bucket's car? Seriously though, I will happily take the road less traveled (so you're into poetry, too?) if that is what I must do. Also, I tried to work on some of what you and Yoda said I needed to work on, and I was quite pleased with the results. I should have some new swings up tonight. Thanks for everything!
nut

[birdie_man]

tgmnut don't worry about thinking too much....unless you're looking for pure execution of the habits you already have ingrained....(when PLAYING I mean)...

It's a very hard game if you aren't one of the ones who has "fluked into" "getting it" easily....

Keep with it and it'll lead to good golf long-term...

And/or see a GOOD AI and you will be set.

...

Ppl tell me I think too much...well....that makes me THINK that they should go to....(insert word).

[tgmnut]

Ppl tell me I think too much...well....that makes me THINK that they should go to....(insert word).

I'm pretty sure I can figure that one out. I agree totally. Well, I have some more footage up after trying to heed Yoda's and Mike O's advice. Tell me what you think.
http://www.geocities.com/robmont64/swing3.html

[Yoda]

I'm pretty sure I can figure that one out. I agree totally. Well, I have some more footage up after trying to heed Yoda's and Mike O's advice. Tell me what you think.
http://www.geocities.com/robmont64/swing3.html

tgmnut,

You may be able to feel the difference -- and that's a first step -- but I cannot see any differences yet. Your Start Up looks exactly the same, and so does your Shift to the Squared Shoulder Plane. On closer inspection, you do seem to have decreased the Bob somewhat.

This time 'round, I would also add the following to your Work In Process Checklist:

1. Left Foot Action. In the Down-the-Line view, check the excess Roll to the outer edge of the Left Foot. Note also the weight toward the toes that has your heel 'tapping' and your Balance teetering. The 'turn' on the heel is not so disruptive, but do you really want all that with a mid-iron?

2. Exaggerated Finish. Again, you are a playing a mid-iron here. This is the super-full Finish one would normally see only with the longest Clubs. The 'wraparound' of your Arms has caused your Hands to separate at the Finish -- the heel of your Right Hand has lost contact with the thumb of the Left Hand. Keep that Pressure Point intact throughout the Stroke, and cut that Finish back.

3. Finish Swivel. You have one, but it is extremely delayed. Your Hands are shoulder-high into the Finish before you finally Swivel. Hitting or Swinging, the Swivel should occur as you exit the Follow-Through (with your Right Forearm about parallel to the ground). You exit the Follow-Through with a non-Swiveled Left Forearm and hence, a Bent Left Wrist. So, Swivel sooner.

[hg]

Are changes that are being suggested ones that can be introduced into a swing and take effect immediately...I would imagine that these are significant enough where it will take hard work and months to work into an effective swing with setbacks at times when one may want to abandon a change.

[Mike O]

TGMNUT,
Lynn makes some very good points in both of his posts #25 and #38. Also, Nice job of retaining your spine angle more and also holding your finish position- in that regard I think Lynn's #2 item in post #38 is an especially excellent point and possibly one of the easier changes that you could add to your already changed finish position. But as HG suggests you've got plenty of information to work with- probably time to hybernate the winter away and see how much progress you've made when you wake up in the spring.

In regards to how I am able to post from Bucket's trunk- well it's called WIRELESS- This guy practically lives at Starbucks- I'm rarely outside of a T-Mobile Hotspot! Whoa- he's headed home now - going to lose you - gotta go!

[Yoda]

Are changes that are being suggested ones that can be introduced into a swing and take effect immediately...I would imagine that these are significant enough where it will take hard work and months to work into an effective swing with setbacks at times when one may want to abandon a change.

You learn to control your Plane Line (12-5-1-#3), your Feet (Balance / 12-5-1-#5), your Right Forearm Tracing (12-5-1-#16) and Hinge Action (12-5-1-#20) in Basic Motion -- two feet back and two feet through.

You extend that understanding into Body Participation, Hand Action Accumulators and On Plane Clubshaft in Acquired Motion (Right Forearm level-to-the-ground in both directions).

You learn to control your Finish Swivel in Total Motion (12-5-3-#3).

Your Finish is dictated by the constraint of the Staged Curriculum, i.e., to Both Arms Straight (Stages One and Two) and to a controlled Finish as dictated by the desired limits of the Pivot and the Arms (Stage Three).

The message:

You don't learn a disciplined Golf Stroke by whacking as many Balls as you can...as far as you can...with every Club in your bag. You learn it piece by piece...one Stage at a time.

For most, this route is too tedious.

Nevertheless...

It is The Shortcut.