Doing that Maximum Trigger Delay garbage made me the king of the snap too . . . snap of a different variety.

Sorry boss . . . I'm sure you had a fine lesson . . . I'm sure he can hit the golf ball and compress it . . . but IMO . . . those pictures don't do the Machine justice as I see it . . . and there are many many many better mouse traps than doing it that way . . . unless of course you're into hittin' it really low and don't care where it goes.

It sure doesnt look like Horizontal to these eyes. Nor any other HInge Action.

Your eye's don't lie and I can't defend his motion with 1-L unless certain allowances are made. But he would tell you that the Head can be moved by the Pivot (with exceptions) but the Pivot should not be moved by the Head.

I only had a glimpse of him. But, I saw a guy with a "commanding" control of the Clubshaft, Clubhead and Clubface.


You're not going to get a Snap Release on an Elbow Plane.

I would never be critical of a teacher as respected as Mr. Doyle. Obviously, Mr. Doyle knows G.O.L.F. and has helped MANY people learn to play, and play great, but to me, the pictures below are what the G.O.L.F. Machine looks like.

Some call us those "Damn Tripoders." :) Oh well, we can't save everybody... :laughing9

Kevin

I don't know mang . . . . I'll give you that he has command of the clubHEAD . . . . but not the shaft and face. I mean D . . . you can't tell me that's a Hinge Motion . . . we could debate Plane . . . but there's no debate on hinging . . . and it is a hinge motion on an inclined plane no?

If that's a snap release . . . . I don't want one . . . that dude's video is still playing havoc with my game.

Question: Why would you want to have that much #2 left when your hands are basically on your left thigh? He may be really good at that but he HAS TO tilt back and shrink his left arm to do it. Most people are going to have trouble with that much range of motion left that late. Too steep too accute too much overlap.









Clubface to the ground . . . . Clubface to the ground . . . . lookin' like fool with your clubface to the ground. Between these two ole girls . . . . I KNOW who I'm gonna ask to the dance.

Kev . . . you're in the biz so I understand your position here . . . I ain't so I choose to speak my mind. Mr. Doyle was my intro to the Machine. I did EVERYTHING in that video . . . I video taped my stuff to see if I could get my motion to look like that . . . accomplished it . . . looked like that but the ball went EVERYWHERE. I grinded on those moves . . . imbedded that stuff in my neuro-pathways or whatever that crap is . . . still won't go away . . . You can hit some good shots doing that . . . but you stand on the tee just wondering when the snake is gonna bite you. Not a good way to play golf.

Control the face . . . control the ball . . . control the game . . . No chance with this.

Hey Bucket,

My post was in no way related to anything you have posted, simply a personal thought...

I love that you express what you really feel, and I continually learn from you. You have no idea how much your presence has influenced me. HUGE!

Thanks Man!
Kevin

He's Right Arm Swinging. The Hinge Pin is his Right Elbow.


He Cocks his Right Wrist. It looks like a Snap Release. Technically, it's not a Snap Release because his Right Wrist begins to Uncock during his Downstroke.

He has no need for a Left Arm except to Pull his Right Elbow as far Forward as possible. His Tilt and Left arm serve to get his Right Elbow to the Ball.

Note that if he were a Left Arm Swinger, he would be playing his Ball Forward of Low Point. Do you think he needs a Shut Clubface?

TGM is complex and worse still obtuse. Being the first Authorized Instructor wasnt easy Id imagine. In the end lets throw him a mulligan and applaud his many many contributions. But in the mean time, this is a discussion that needs to happen. Many people new to TGM see that over roll and ask just these sorts of questions.

Ironic wasnt it that it was Mr Doyle who was standing behind Mr Blake in the smash hit Finish Swivel video? Lynn is not one to correct the errors of others......Lord knows he'd need a lot of time, specially around here with some of my doozers, but......is this an ironic bit of happen stance or a gentleman's polite submission to the contrary and for the record? We'll never know. Doesnt matter I guess.

http://www.lynnblakegolf.com/index.p...sh-Swivel.html

12-3-0 pt 22 "DELIVERY LINE ROLL PREP" emphasizes "ROLL" but it does not mean that "more is better". Its a geometry problem with a geometric answer.

Are you crazy man! There are certain people LURKING . . .

Dangerous . . . . build a secret bunker . . . enter the witness protection program . . . hide the wife, kids, dawg, cat, livestock, tighty whiteez, cheetoz and peanut butter . . . by all means . . . protect yourself and take this down for your own safety.

So Bently J. Doyle is teaching right arm swinging now??? Wow.

I said that the Swing you presented, with your Photo, is a Right Arm Swing (Procedure). I don't know if he does it all of the Time. But, in this Photo, let there be no doubt, he is Right Arm Swinging.

Let me say further, that Ben KNOWS TGM, and that he's aware of what he is doing. Nothing wrong with Right Arm Swinging.

What pattern did you get at the lesson? Maximum participation swinging? Is that still the M.O.?

I did the pattern . . . unfortunately I ain't got no mulligans left to throw . . . used 'em all up.:happy3:

Right Arm Swinging. :laughing9 :laughing9

Maximum #3 Pressure and get that Right Elbow as far forward as possible. After a little, he said "Fade" and I would Fade; "Draw" and I would Draw; "5 Yard Draw", and I would 5 Yard Draw.

I was getting pretty good at it until I took it to the Golf Course that afternoon. I said "5 Yard Draw" and I would hit a Tree Trunk, "5 Yard Fade" and I would hit a Tree Branch.

That pattern skatters more vectors than the hair lipped "chef" skatters hashbrowns at the Waffle Casa . . .

I'll give him credit for keeping his right wrist bent . . . . and . . . not falling down. He's about 25% on 1-L 1-21.

While we've got a break in the action.......For those of you following at home.

Bucket's last submission relates to:

1-L-21 "The relations of all Machine positions and motioins can be described by a geometric figure."

Did I say TGM was "obtuse" earlier? All I got on that one is that the geometric figures should always be two dimensional, that is they must always be able lie flat on the Inclined Plane. Three dimensions would "bend" the Plane Line!

Lets see how Daryl handles that "curve" ball? Now back to the action.............

I wasn't talkin' just about #21 . . . I was talking about ALL 21 items . . . . but I would agree . . . #21 is violated.

Sorry I just had one of those hand rolled cigarets you left at my place. Man those things make me feel weird . Hey what's your favorite candy bar anyways?

This thread was picked up from last year by Bartly in his Post #65, asking about Hip Action.

"Bartly" seems pretty satisfied with Buckets answer in Post #67. Then, Edz got Bucket drinking whiskey again with his Post #68 and O.B. Left yanked Bucket overboard. We moved a tad-bit away from the original question. But, the subject remained TGM related so I guess Bucket didn't stray too far. :laughing9

Actually the thread got started by that Jeff dude that got run off . . . but noticed that there's a jeffm lurking around . . . not posting . . . what's up jeff! how you livin' man??!!??

But I'd like to revoke my response in post #67 and advise my man "bartly" to employ a right arm swinging procedure . . . and buy some waders and a ball retriever.

Daryl,
I'm firing up the Jet for Minnesota - get ready - need to be on top alert - could be a tough one to take down!

Try and sneak up on him while he's in the shower, that when he's most vulnerable. There was a failed take down a couple of weeks back. Advise extreme caution.

Careful, careful, careful. Never sneak up on a wounded, but healing bear.

Kev, do you have the key for the airport lights? It sounds like our idyllic lifestyle on the tundra may be invaded by well-meaning TGMers.

Sadlowski
 

Anytime I see Bucket in a thread, I have to read it. But, I have to comment on the Sadlowski photos.

When he won the Remax, he missed the grid with all 6 shots and found himself in the loser’s bracket. In that bracket, he missed the grid with his first 5 shots and landed the sixth in the grid to advance. He continued the hard way, from the loser’s bracket, and ended up winning.

We have to separate golf from long drive. I've had students successful in both, and the goals are different.

I'd play anyone that needed 11 mulligans.

i SNAPPED THE TOWEL TONIGHT FOR THE FIRST TIME EVER!
 

I was lollygagging down the plane, grooving on the natural Tomasello back shoulder down and thrust. I switched to a swing and the motion was powerful and quick. :clap:

For yucks, I tried a quicker back shoulder drop and fire! I gained about 15 yards in the air. Towel-snap! :toothy1:

I hope mr. Tomasello is enjoying a nice lemonade/Iced tea mix in heaven. He made my day. I also turned on one of the younger pros at our driving range to the site. He's in HS and has played some serious amateur tournaments. He was raving bout the great videos and I told him to check out Tomasello after buying the Alignment Golf DVDs! :dance:

Play well tomorrow, folks. Kevin, how's the left arm swing?

Pat

Exactly 50-50 to hit THE RANGE . . . if he's the model for a snap release . . . better snap outta that . . .

I reviewed the first 20 Chapters of Ben Doyles G.O.L.F. Tape last night and I didn't see a single instance of Right Arm Swinging. In Fact, it would seem that his Standard Pattern is a Double Plane Shift Elbow Plane Swing with a Random Sweep Release. A mighty fine one at that. However, I also saw a few perfectly executed Single Shift Turned Shoulder Plane Swings with Snap Releases. When demonstrating a Punch Elbow Major Stroke, he stopped short of Hitting the Ball. I guess that's a line he won't cross (no pun intended). :laughing9 :laughing9 TGM Humor.

In his instruction video, Ben Doyle states that he uses "Hip Action Uncocks the Left Wrist and Hip Action Straightens the Right Arm", chapter 20. "Hip Action for Centrifugal Acceleration (increases Mass)", chapter 21.

Unfortunately, when he Talks about COAM, he misses the point. He talks about "Sustaining" COAM, where-as HK claims that the Throwout of the Secondary Lever replaces the Acceleration that COAM is taking away.

D, does Ben Doyle ever teach or demonstrate Hitting? How bout a Non Automatic Release Trigger when Swinging?

And if you dont mind, this Random Sweep Releaser wants to know how he teaches the delayed Release. Is it just Drag Loading the Handle past the eye line to the ball with the Left Hand turned to plane?

Thanks man.

See the new topic "Ben Doyle 24 Components" in the "LAB"